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Patteeu Memorial Political Forum>Are you going to take the vaccine?
GloryDayz 08:48 AM 12-01-2020
I know I'm going to try to be first in line, but what about the rest of you? I'm not sure if the death count is where the science community wants it to be, plus Birdbrain hasn't been sworn in, so I expect there will be delays, but that's beside the point.

You can be honest.
[Reply]
banyon 10:14 AM 09-23-2021
Originally Posted by Monticore:
No wonder China has soo many people in it, if the sole qualifier is having more medical knowledge than him , with the amount he posts they are going to have a huge population boom.
:-)
[Reply]
RaidersOftheCellar 10:15 AM 09-23-2021
Originally Posted by BucEyedPea:
Covid does, but not if treated early with the effective drugs that reduce those things. Such as the drugs that are suppressed and dissed. But the vaccines cause the problem too, plus more. Like expanding a dying-out virus that was extinct, into another pandemic making more people sick who also die.
I was questioning his declaration of "far more." How does a person confidently come to that conclusion?

The opposite is far more likely.
[Reply]
Discuss Thrower 10:16 AM 09-23-2021
Originally Posted by banyon:
what official policy?
"Get the jab or lose your job."
[Reply]
banyon 10:18 AM 09-23-2021
Originally Posted by Discuss Thrower:
"Get the jab or lose your job."
US policy is set by a random quote? Also what does that have to do with "social credit"?
[Reply]
Donger 10:18 AM 09-23-2021
Originally Posted by RaidersOftheCellar:
So your argument is that some PCR tests are intended for diagnostic use and some aren't? Interesting.

Mullis never said anything like that? How do you interpret this?

"With PCR, if you do it well, you can find almost anything in anybody. If you can amplify one single molecule up to something that you can really measure, which PCR can do....there's very few molecules that you don't have at least one single one of in the body. So that could be thought of as a misuse, to claim that it's meaningful."

It's a method of analysis and wasn't designed to diagnose a virus. Spin it all you want, Covidian.

Why wasn't there a massive spike during flu season? Well, remember the WHO memo which led to cases plummeting in January as providers began using PCR at proper thresholds? I know, you think it was all a big coincidence that they slipped that guidance through just as Biden was inaugurated and also merely coincidence that cases plummeted exactly at that moment. That's how a Covidian's mind works. You couldn't have been programmed better in a laboratory.
Again, you claimed that Mullis said this:

He said that PCR tests are very unreliable for detecting viral matter

Not diagnosing anything, unless you want to call detecting a virus a diagnosis, which you can.

Now, per the Roche test above (which you were wrong about), you can see that their PCR test detects SARS-CoV-2. How can that be?

Aha! So yes, all the 30 million flu cases got counted as COVID-19. But, once again, we didn't the see the COVID-19 cases jump by millions at all. So there goes that stupid theory. And again, the PCR tests don't detect influenza so wrong again.
[Reply]
Monticore 10:23 AM 09-23-2021
Originally Posted by MahomesMagic:
Speaking of your great medical knowledge, what happened to your promise that the vaccines would be better than natural immunity?

You insisted that they would be.
I was just referencing something I read in a few places, science can change though

New CDC Study: Vaccination Offers Higher Protection than Previous COVID-19 Infection


https://www.cdc.gov/media/releases/2...rotection.html
[Reply]
MahomesMagic 10:33 AM 09-23-2021
Originally Posted by Monticore:
I was just referencing something I read in a few places, science can change though

New CDC Study: Vaccination Offers Higher Protection than Previous COVID-19 Infection


https://www.cdc.gov/media/releases/2...rotection.html
Do you actually believe that "study"?

Are you familiar with the criticisms raised on how they got there?

Are you willing to take that one flawed "study" against the totality of every other report that natural immunity is stronger, lasts longer, and is better against variants than the current covid vaccines?
[Reply]
Monticore 10:36 AM 09-23-2021
[QUOTE=MahomesMagic;15850112]Do you actually believe that "study"?

Are you familiar with the criticisms raised on how they got there?

Are you willing to take that one flawed "study" against the totality of every other report that natural immunity is stronger, lasts longer, and is better against variants than the current covid vaccines?[/

Read few studies quickly , using a wait and see approach for now .

https://www.immunology.org/coronavir...ection-vaccine
[Reply]
lawrenceRaider 10:36 AM 09-23-2021
Originally Posted by MahomesMagic:
Do you actually believe that "study"?

Are you familiar with the criticisms raised on how they got there?

Are you willing to take that one flawed "study" against the totality of every other report that natural immunity is stronger, lasts longer, and is better against variants than the current covid vaccines?
I've not seen more than a single study, and it was retracted, stating that natural immunity was more effective.

That's not to say that there aren't plenty of studies pointing out that recovery from COVID creates long lasting, effective, immunity. Mostly seems to be in the 70-80% effective range.

Feel free to post peer reviewed studies supporting your claim. I'd love to read them.
[Reply]
banyon 10:36 AM 09-23-2021
Originally Posted by MahomesMagic:
Do you actually believe that "study"?

Are you familiar with the criticisms raised on how they got there?

Are you willing to take that one flawed "study" against the totality of every other report that natural immunity is stronger, lasts longer, and is better against variants than the current covid vaccines?
You act like there are a plethora of studies showing that natural immunity is better, but isn't it pretty much just that one israeli study?
[Reply]
banyon 10:43 AM 09-23-2021
Good summary of natural immunity vs vaccine by those commie pinkos at Nebraska Med:

A third of infections don't get any protective antibodies
Some people who get COVID-19 receive no protection from reinfection – their natural immunity is nonexistent. A recent study found that 36% of COVID-19 cases didn't result in development of SARS-CoV-2 antibodies. The people had different levels of illness – most had moderate disease, but some were asymptomatic and some experienced severe COVID-19.

"Vaccine-induced immunity is more predictable than natural immunity," says Dr. Rupp. The COVID-19 vaccines provide great protection from severe disease, hospitalization and death.

Natural immunity fades more quickly than vaccine immunity
Natural immunity can decay within about 90 days. Immunity from COVID-19 vaccines has been shown to last longer. Both Pfizer and Moderna reported strong vaccine protection for at least six months.

Studies are ongoing to evaluate the full duration of protective immunity, including the Johnson & Johnson vaccine.

Real-world studies also indicate natural immunity's short life. For example, 65% of people with a lower baseline antibody from infection to begin with completely lost their COVID-19 antibodies by 60 days.

What about that Israeli study suggesting natural immunity is stronger? Infectious diseases expert James Lawler, MD, MPH, FIDSA, carefully evaluates the study design of the retrospective Maccabi Health System study in his Aug. 31 briefing. In the briefing, he identifies two concerning sources of error that were not corrected for: survivorship bias and selection bias.

Natural immunity alone is weak
One study compared natural immunity alone to natural immunity plus vaccination. They found that, after infection, unvaccinated people are 2.34 times likelier to get COVID-19 again, compared to fully vaccinated people. So vaccinated people (after infection) have half the risk of reinfection than people relying on natural immunity alone.

"Studies show that the vaccine gives a very good booster response if you've had COVID-19 before," says Dr. Rupp.

Furthermore, there is no country on the globe in which natural infection and natural immunity has brought the pandemic under control. In countries like Iran or Brazil very high levels of natural infection have not prevented recurrent waves of infection.

We recommend that people with post-COVID syndrome (long haulers) should get the vaccine as well. There are some reports of people with post-COVID syndrome experiencing marked improvement in symptoms following vaccination.

https://www.nebraskamed.com/COVID/co...us-vaccination
[Reply]
BlackOp 10:47 AM 09-23-2021
Originally Posted by banyon:
Well I guess that illustrates how much I give a shit about it.
Lets paint the picture on how social credit score will work....you are already seeing it in play in Australia.

It started with a vaccine mandates but is now linked to their bank account and online communications. If they defy government orders or say "unapproved" things...the can simply deduct fines from your account. No court date..nothing.

As this progresses, the government can commit what ever crimes against its citizens it wants and if you even think of protesting...they'll just take your money. It'll be ultimately linked to your ability to get employment and travel within your own country.

In China, if you communicate with someone that has a low score...it drops your score. So if a family member is disobedient to the state...you either sever communication or risk retaliation.

So yes...you should "give a shit" about it....it has the potential to completely **** up your life....and you'll become an obedient slave.

They can make whatever demands they want in the future...they can force you into medical treatments against your will. They can ban religion....they can destroy families.

It's the whole reason behind it...complete control.
[Reply]
MahomesMagic 10:47 AM 09-23-2021
Originally Posted by banyon:
You act like there are a plethora of studies showing that natural immunity is better, but isn't it pretty much just that one israeli study?
You do realize Fauci himself admitted natural immunity was as strong or stronger...

he then hedged to push the vaccines by saying "we don't know how long it (natural immunity) lasts".


The default position from every immunologist and infectious disease expert BEFORE the vaccine rollout was that for viruses (I guess bacterial vaccines are different) we have never had a superior vaccine to natural immunity.

The point of a vaccine is to get as close to natural infection as possible in immune response without having the disease. So this was to be expected and it is on the vaccine pushers to prove this time is different.

These aren't all peer-reviewed yet but plenty besides Israel.

California:

mRNA vaccine-induced SARS-CoV-2-specific T cells recognize B.1.1.7 and B.1.351 variants but differ in longevity and homing properties depending on prior infection status
Jason Neidleman, Xiaoyu Luo, Matthew McGregor, Guorui Xie, Victoria Murray, Warner C. Greene, Sulggi A. Lee, Nadia R. Roan
doi: https://doi.org/10.1101/2021.05.12.443888

https://www.biorxiv.org/content/10.1...05.12.443888v1

Cleveland Clinic (I saw various top infectious disease people sign off on this although it is not peer-reviewed yet)

Necessity of COVID-19 vaccination in previously infected individuals
View ORCID ProfileNabin K. Shrestha, Patrick C. Burke, Amy S. Nowacki, Paul Terpeluk, Steven M. Gordon

https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1....01.21258176v2


Makary of Johns Hopkins called the CDC Kentucky "study" manipulation and cherry picking of less than 500 people to get the answer they wanted to push.
[Reply]
MahomesMagic 10:51 AM 09-23-2021
Originally Posted by banyon:
Good summary of natural immunity vs vaccine by those commie pinkos at Nebraska Med:

A third of infections don't get any protective antibodies
Some people who get COVID-19 receive no protection from reinfection – their natural immunity is nonexistent. A recent study found that 36% of COVID-19 cases didn't result in development of SARS-CoV-2 antibodies. The people had different levels of illness – most had moderate disease, but some were asymptomatic and some experienced severe COVID-19.

"Vaccine-induced immunity is more predictable than natural immunity," says Dr. Rupp. The COVID-19 vaccines provide great protection from severe disease, hospitalization and death.

Natural immunity fades more quickly than vaccine immunity
Natural immunity can decay within about 90 days. Immunity from COVID-19 vaccines has been shown to last longer. Both Pfizer and Moderna reported strong vaccine protection for at least six months.

Studies are ongoing to evaluate the full duration of protective immunity, including the Johnson & Johnson vaccine.

Real-world studies also indicate natural immunity's short life. For example, 65% of people with a lower baseline antibody from infection to begin with completely lost their COVID-19 antibodies by 60 days.

What about that Israeli study suggesting natural immunity is stronger? Infectious diseases expert James Lawler, MD, MPH, FIDSA, carefully evaluates the study design of the retrospective Maccabi Health System study in his Aug. 31 briefing. In the briefing, he identifies two concerning sources of error that were not corrected for: survivorship bias and selection bias.

Natural immunity alone is weak
One study compared natural immunity alone to natural immunity plus vaccination. They found that, after infection, unvaccinated people are 2.34 times likelier to get COVID-19 again, compared to fully vaccinated people. So vaccinated people (after infection) have half the risk of reinfection than people relying on natural immunity alone.

"Studies show that the vaccine gives a very good booster response if you've had COVID-19 before," says Dr. Rupp.

Furthermore, there is no country on the globe in which natural infection and natural immunity has brought the pandemic under control. In countries like Iran or Brazil very high levels of natural infection have not prevented recurrent waves of infection.

We recommend that people with post-COVID syndrome (long haulers) should get the vaccine as well. There are some reports of people with post-COVID syndrome experiencing marked improvement in symptoms following vaccination.

https://www.nebraskamed.com/COVID/co...us-vaccination
Terrible propaganda and it references a less than 500 person CDC "study" which was called manipulation and cherry picking by Marty Makary of Johns Hopkins.


Natural immunity fades more quickly than vaccine immunity
Natural immunity can decay within about 90 days. Immunity from COVID-19 vaccines has been shown to last longer. Both Pfizer and Moderna reported strong vaccine protection for at least six months.

Anyone who believe shit like is an idiot.
[Reply]
RaidersOftheCellar 10:53 AM 09-23-2021
Originally Posted by Donger:
Again, you claimed that Mullis said this:

He said that PCR tests are very unreliable for detecting viral matter

Not diagnosing anything, unless you want to call detecting a virus a diagnosis, which you can.

Now, per the Roche test above (which you were wrong about), you can see that their PCR test detects SARS-CoV-2. How can that be?

Aha! So yes, all the 30 million flu cases got counted as COVID-19. But, once again, we didn't the see the COVID-19 cases jump by millions at all. So there goes that stupid theory. And again, the PCR tests don't detect influenza so wrong again.
Wrong as ever, but there's no use in continuing to explain the same things again and again and again. Did I not just point out why cases didn't jump significantly during that period? Do you read anything before copying and pasting your stock replies?

I think you're stuck on repeat. Might need to return to the lab for a tune-up.

Btw, where does it say that the Roche test is meant for diagnostic use? Must have missed that.
[Reply]
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