Originally Posted by :
66. S JUAN THORNHILL, KANSAS CITY CHIEFS
Contract Projection: Two years, $11 million ($5.5M per year); $6 million total guaranteed
Thornhill has been up and down over the start of his career, prone to the occasional missed tackle and coverage lapse. But to his credit, he is finishing off his third trip to the Super Bowl in four seasons on a high note. Over his past five games (Week 16 through the conference championship), Thornhill’s 90.5 grade is the top mark among safeties by five grading points, with his 88.8 coverage grade also the highest at the position.
Thornhill has played at least 850 snaps in each of his first four seasons and offers a high floor of play on the backend.
We will see this off-season what type of contract Juan Thornhill receives. [Reply]
Originally Posted by kccrow:
Good thing KC transitioned to a two-high safety look this season :-)
Cook was thrown in sporadically this season into a variety of situations from the bench so comparing him to Thornhill who started his rookie year doesn't hold much weight for me. You're comparing a sprinkling of plays to a consistent season of plays. Not only that, Cook didn't perform that differently from Thornhill, who many here are lauding.
One thing cdcox brought up was his rating against.
Well here are some stats for you:
Juan Thornhill allowed 68.1% completions for 13.4 ypc and 9.1 yards per target (105.6 rating)
Bryan Cook allowed 70.0% completions for 13.3 ypc and 9.3 yards per target (138.7 rating)
Do you see the similarity between the entirety of the stats instead of cherry-picking the one stat that makes the guy look worse?
But it's fair to note that Thornhill was being asked to do more, is it not? He was a full time starter at the time, he was playing significant single-high snaps where he was asked to cover a heck of a lot more ground than Cook has been.
And we've never been a strict cover 1 team; but we played it a fair amount. We got away from it a little this year, but it was still something we would fake into quite a bit. In fact, don't you figure this is exactly the sort of matchup where we'll be using more single high/cover 1 looks?
Like I said - I think we can survive without doing much of it. But it's awfully nice being able to utilize it when the situation calls for it. Moreover, even having the ability to use it gives quarterbacks one more thing to have to think about. It's one of the primary features of using a 3-safety look; you're able to really present a number of different pre-snap looks and then rotate into something else entirely at the snap.
That's just going to be more difficult without a guy like Thornhill back there. [Reply]
Originally Posted by O.city:
As much as we think of Thornhill as a deep single high safety....how many actual plays on the ball has he made out of that situation?
Lots as a rookie. He was a mess his soph year coming off injury. And the last couple years he's just been up and down in the role. Any role, really.
I think a lot of it is mental with Thornhill. When he's confident and playing fast, he's very good out there. But he seems to get in his own head a little bit.
But the version of him we saw as a rookie and then at various points last year and in the 2nd half this season, he's been a really effective single high safety.
But it's not like we go out there and line up in a 46 defense or anything. We start out in cover 2 looks. But all those times that Reid is playing underneath routes or close to or in the box, it's Thornhill we're tasking to play CF there in a sort of cover 1 or cover 3 look. [Reply]
Originally Posted by DJ's left nut:
Lots as a rookie. He was a mess his soph year coming off injury. And the last couple years he's just been up and down in the role. Any role, really.
I think a lot of it is mental with Thornhill. When he's confident and playing fast, he's very good out there. But he seems to get in his own head a little bit.
But the version of him we saw as a rookie and then at various points last year and in the 2nd half this season, he's been a really effective single high safety.
But it's not like we go out there and line up in a 46 defense or anything. We start out in cover 2 looks. But all those times that Reid is playing underneath routes or close to or in the box, it's Thornhill we're tasking to play CF there in a sort of cover 1 or cover 3 look.
But I think he's made most of those plays from said cover 2 look. I just don't remember him coming off the MOF to make a play as much. His rookie year yeah he did a bit more, but they also seemed to play it alot more then.
I dunno, I've really come around on Cook. He seems like he really may come on and be a real difference maker. [Reply]
Originally Posted by O.city:
But I think he's made most of those plays from said cover 2 look. I just don't remember him coming off the MOF to make a play as much. His rookie year yeah he did a bit more, but they also seemed to play it alot more then.
I dunno, I've really come around on Cook. He seems like he really may come on and be a real difference maker.
Again - I'm fine letting Cook take the reigns next season unless we can bring back Thornhill much cheaper than I expect him to get.
I don't know that I've 'come around' on Cook - but I've seen enough to give him a shot at the big chair.
I just think we're overlooking some of the skills that Thornhill brings to the table and what we'd lose if we let him walk. It wouldn't be a zero cost loss. He has some real top level skills, IMO.
But you've gotta make hard choices here and there and we DO have a high value pick waiting for a chance to start at S. So we make the move there. [Reply]
Originally Posted by DJ's left nut:
But it's fair to note that Thornhill was being asked to do more, is it not? He was a full time starter at the time, he was playing significant single-high snaps where he was asked to cover a heck of a lot more ground than Cook has been.
And we've never been a strict cover 1 team; but we played it a fair amount. We got away from it a little this year, but it was still something we would fake into quite a bit. In fact, don't you figure this is exactly the sort of matchup where we'll be using more single high/cover 1 looks?
Like I said - I think we can survive without doing much of it. But it's awfully nice being able to utilize it when the situation calls for it. Moreover, even having the ability to use it gives quarterbacks one more thing to have to think about. It's one of the primary features of using a 3-safety look; you're able to really present a number of different pre-snap looks and then rotate into something else entirely at the snap.
That's just going to be more difficult without a guy like Thornhill back there.
Honestly, I don't really worry about Cook in any look for the long term. He's got speed, you've seen it. I can't say I'm worried about his range. He played CB well for 2 years at Howard before moving to safety when he transferred to Cincinnati where he was also good in coverage. Cook has limited reps and made some rookie mistakes. He studies the game so I think he'll learn from those mistakes and correct things. I think he's going to end up a better player than Thornhill has been. His awareness and ability to attack downhill are already better and his coverage has been largely the same as a 4-year veteran. [Reply]
