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The Gonzo Lounge>***NON-POLITICAL COVID-19 Discussion Thread***
JakeF 10:28 PM 02-26-2020
A couple of reminders...

Originally Posted by Bwana:
Once again, don't come in this thread with some kind of political agenda, or you will be shown the door. If you want to go that route, there is a thread about this in DC.
Originally Posted by Dartgod:
People, there is a lot of good information in this thread, let's try to keep the petty bickering to a minimum.

We all have varying opinions about the impact of this, the numbers, etc. We will all never agree with each other. But we can all keep it civil.

Thanks!

Click here for the original OP:

Spoiler!

[Reply]
TLO 09:09 AM 06-07-2021
Originally Posted by TLO:
What's this I'm hearing about the Pfizer vaccine not being all that effective against the Indian variant? Just saw a headline and haven't looked into it much more.
OCity you seen anything on this?
[Reply]
Rain Man 09:44 AM 06-07-2021
I saw that a high school classmate of mine (a year or two older) died of Covid yesterday. That's eye-opening.
[Reply]
loochy 11:03 AM 06-07-2021
Originally Posted by TLO:
What's this I'm hearing about the Pfizer vaccine not being all that effective against the Indian variant? Just saw a headline and haven't looked into it much more.
https://www.webmd.com/vaccines/covid...-india-variant


Originally Posted by :
The research team analyzed antibodies in the blood of 250 healthy people, ages 33-52, up to 3 months after receiving their first dose of the Pfizer COVID-19 vaccine. The team looked for “neutralizing antibodies,” or the ability of antibodies to block the virus from entering cells.

The researchers tested five variants: the original strain discovered in China, the dominant strain in Europe during the first wave in April 2020, the B.1.1.7 variant discovered in the U.K., the B.1.351 variant first seen in South Africa, and the newest variant of concern, which is the B.1.617.2 variant discovered in India.

The team compared the concentrations of the neutralizing antibodies among the variants. They found that people who had been fully vaccinated with two Pfizer doses had antibodies that were 6 times lower against the B.1.617.2 variant, 5 times lower against the B.1.351 variant, and 2.6 times lower against the B.1.1.7 variant when compared to the original strain.

The antibody response was even lower in people who had received only one dose. After a single Pfizer dose, 79% of people had neutralizing antibodies against the original strain, which fell to 50% for the B.1.1.7 variant, 32% for the B.1.617.2 variant, and 25% for the B.1.351 variant.
Now what does "5 times lower" mean? I don't know. They didn't give original counts and they didn't give a specific amount of antibodies required to be effective, so these numbers are meaningless to me.
[Reply]
loochy 11:09 AM 06-07-2021
The actual study:

https://www.thelancet.com/journals/l...290-3/fulltext

Interesting snippets:

Originally Posted by :
However, it is worth highlighting that in the case of two BNT162b2 doses, our cohort of generally healthy, relatively young, recently vaccinated, and mostly single-ethnicity individuals presents a reasonable best-case scenario for NAb activity against SARS-CoV-2 variants. Indeed, regardless of the absolute vaccine efficacy requirements, peak NAbTs are significantly reduced against VOCs B.1.617.2 and B.1.351 compared with NAbTs against earlier variants, and consequently, vaccine efficacy on an individual or sub-population level will become more sensitive to reductions in NAbTs occurring as a result of factors aside from virus strain (appendix p 5), providing a basis to understand observed vaccine efficacy failure in other combinations of vaccine and target population.6
Originally Posted by :
In the longer term, we note that both increased age and time since the second dose of BNT162b2 significantly correlate with decreased NAb activity against B.1.617.2 and B.1.351—both of which are also characteristic of the population in the UK at highest risk of severe COVID-19 (ie, older and vaccinated earlier), independent of other existing factors such as compromised immune status or comorbidity, or geographic-specific responses to vaccination.
Originally Posted by :
Consequently, further booster immunisations of JCVI Priority Groups in the UK and similar groups in other counties, as well as others with lower vaccine-induced NAbTs than the cohort of BNT162b2 recipients studied here (ideally with modified vaccines that induce NAbs that broadly neutralise emerging VOCs) are more likely to be required to maintain the highest levels of NAbs in regions where B.1.617.2 or other equally NAb-resistant strains become prevalent.
This study, although rather small, shows the following: It looks like age significantly decreases the antibodies produced and so does time. If you're young and healthy, you'll fare much better. It appears that this will end up going the way of the flu shot, with yearly boosters required to better match the prevalent variants.
[Reply]
TLO 11:20 AM 06-07-2021
Originally Posted by loochy:
https://www.webmd.com/vaccines/covid...-india-variant

Now what does "5 times lower" mean? I don't know. They didn't give original counts and they didn't give a specific amount of antibodies required to be effective, so these numbers are meaningless to me.
Originally Posted by loochy:
The actual study:

https://www.thelancet.com/journals/l...290-3/fulltext

Interesting snippets:


This study, although rather small, shows the following: It looks like age significantly decreases the antibodies produced and so does time. If you're young and healthy, you'll fare much better. It appears that this will end up going the way of the flu shot, with yearly boosters required to better match the prevalent variants.
Thanks. I dove in and read the study earlier this morning. This bit made me question exactly how useful the study actually is.

Originally Posted by :
However, levels of antibodies alone do not predict vaccine effectiveness and prospective population studies are also needed.

[Reply]
TLO 04:12 PM 06-10-2021
Seeing a bit of an uptick in cases in our area. We were steady at 1, 2, 5 cases per day for a long time. We've been up around 11, 15 17, 18 over the past few days.
[Reply]
DaFace 04:18 PM 06-10-2021
Originally Posted by TLO:
Seeing a bit of an uptick in cases in our area. We were sta sta steady at 1, 2, 5 cases per day for a long time. We've been up around 11, 15 17, 18 over the past few days.
We're starting to see pretty clear patterns related to vaccines in Colorado. We're in relatively good shape in Denver, where vaccination rates are high, but Grand Junction is getting hit hard (relatively speaking - still nothing compared to the fall).

I've generally decided that I'm just not all that worried about it. The vaccines are working really well, so if people choose not to get them and pay the consequences, it is what it is.

I do feel bad for healthcare workers, though. It has to be intensely frustrating to have people getting it when they could have avoided it.
[Reply]
Chief Pagan 06:57 PM 06-10-2021
I try to limit how much I worry about things I have no control over. And it's great news that the vaccines are, so far anyway, doing really well even against the variants.

But it's not just hospital workers. It's sad to see the suffering that could have been avoided. But there is also a tremendous financial cost for anyone who ends up at a hospital. A cost that is going to be paid through other people's premiums and taxes depending on what type of insurance the person has.

And some of those who get sick, who may not have even gone to the hospital initially, will end up with some version of long covid. And it sounds like some of those could likely rack up large life time health bills.

But hey, it all doesn't effect anyone else because the vaccines are 85% effective against the variants.
[Reply]
TLO 06:59 PM 06-10-2021
I need to stay out of the DC Covid discussions.
[Reply]
Monticore 05:59 AM Yesterday
Originally Posted by TLO:
I need to stay out of the DC Covid discussions.
You call those discussions?
[Reply]
BigCatDaddy 06:51 AM Yesterday
Originally Posted by TLO:
I need to stay out of the DC.
This is an even better idea.
[Reply]
TLO 06:52 AM Yesterday
Originally Posted by Monticore:
You call those discussions?
Originally Posted by BigCatDaddy:
This is an even better idea.
:-) :-)
[Reply]
NotDonger 09:13 AM Yesterday
Originally Posted by TLO:
What's this I'm hearing about the Pfizer vaccine not being all that effective against the Indian variant? Just saw a headline and haven't looked into it much more.
Here you go, TLO:

The variant has become the dominant strain in the U.K., accounting for an estimated 60% of new cases. It’s now more prevalent than the Alpha strain, formerly called the B.1.1.7 strain, which was first identified in the U.K., and transmission is peaking in people between the ages of 12 and 20, White House chief medical advisor Dr. Anthony Fauci said at a press briefing Tuesday.

In the U.S., the Delta variant accounts for more than 6% of cases scientists have been able to sequence, he said. The actual number is likely higher, as the U.S. is running the genetic sequence on a fraction of cases.

Studies also show that two doses of the Pfizer or AstraZeneca shots are effective against the Delta strain, according to the National Institutes of Health.

Two doses of the Pfizer vaccine were shown to be 88% effective against the Delta variant, while two doses of the AstraZeneca shot were shown to be 60% effective against the strain, according to NIH data.

Fauci stressed the importance of getting two doses after NIH studies showed that, three weeks after being given, just one dose of either vaccine provided only 33% efficacy against the Delta variant.


Two doses = good.
[Reply]
NotDonger 09:15 AM Yesterday
Originally Posted by TLO:
I need to stay out of the DC Covid discussions.
Agreed. That place is a cesspool.
[Reply]
TLO 06:28 AM Today
Read an article this morning that there are several hot spots in Missouri right now. SW Missouri is seeing an uptick in hospitalized cases, primarily in people under 40. Areas being hit the hardest are among some of the lowest vaccination numbers in the state. :-)
[Reply]
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