Originally Posted by Bwana:
Once again, don't come in this thread with some kind of political agenda, or you will be shown the door. If you want to go that route, there is a thread about this in DC.
Originally Posted by Dartgod:
People, there is a lot of good information in this thread, let's try to keep the petty bickering to a minimum.
We all have varying opinions about the impact of this, the numbers, etc. We will all never agree with each other. But we can all keep it civil.
Thanks!
Click here for the original OP:
Spoiler!
Apparently the CoronaVirus can survive on a inanimate objects, such as door knobs, for 9 days.
California coronavirus case could be first spread within U.S. community, CDC says
By SOUMYA KARLAMANGLA, JACLYN COSGROVE
FEB. 26, 2020 8:04 PM
The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention is investigating what could be the first case of novel coronavirus in the United States involving a patient in California who neither recently traveled out of the country nor was in contact with someone who did.
“At this time, the patient’s exposure is unknown. It’s possible this could be an instance of community spread of COVID-19, which would be the first time this has happened in the United States,” the CDC said in a statement. “Community spread means spread of an illness for which the source of infection is unknown. It’s also possible, however, that the patient may have been exposed to a returned traveler who was infected.”
The individual is a resident of Solano County and is receiving medical care in Sacramento County, according to the state Department of Public Health.
The CDC said the “case was detected through the U.S. public health system — picked up by astute clinicians.”
Officials at UC Davis Medical Center expanded on what the federal agency might have meant by that in an email sent Wednesday, as reported by the Davis Enterprise newspaper.
The patient arrived at UC Davis Medical Center from another hospital Feb. 19 and “had already been intubated, was on a ventilator, and given droplet protection orders because of an undiagnosed and suspected viral condition,” according to an email sent by UC Davis officials that was obtained by the Davis Enterprise.
The staff at UC Davis requested COVID-19 testing by the CDC, but because the patient didn’t fit the CDC’s existing criteria for the virus, a test wasn’t immediately administered, according to the email. The CDC then ordered the test Sunday, and results were announced Wednesday. Hospital administrators reportedly said in the email that despite these issues, there has been minimal exposure at the hospital because of safety protocols they have in place.
A UC Davis Health spokesperson declined Wednesday evening to share the email with The Times.
Since Feb. 2, more than 8,400 returning travelers from China have entered California, according to the state health department. They have been advised to self-quarantine for 14 days and limit interactions with others as much as possible, officials said.
“This is a new virus, and while we are still learning about it, there is a lot we already know,” Dr. Sonia Angell, director of the California Department of Public Health, said in a statement. “We have been anticipating the potential for such a case in the U.S., and given our close familial, social and business relationships with China, it is not unexpected that the first case in the U.S. would be in California.”
It is not clear how the person became infected, but public health workers could not identify any contacts with people who had traveled to China or other areas where the virus is widespread. That raises concern that the virus is spreading in the United States, creating a challenge for public health officials, experts say.
“It’s the first signal that we could be having silent transmission in the community,” said Lawrence Gostin, director of the World Health Organization Collaborating Center on National and Global Health Law. “It probably means there are many more cases out there, and it probably means this individual has infected others, and now it’s a race to try to find out who that person has infected.”
On Tuesday, the CDC offered its most serious warning to date that the United States should expect and prepare for the coronavirus to become a more widespread health issue.
“Ultimately, we expect we will see coronavirus spread in this country,” said Nancy Messonnier, director of the CDC’s National Center for Immunization and Respiratory Diseases. “It’s not so much a question of if, but a question of when.”
According to the CDC’s latest count Wednesday morning, 59 U.S. residents have tested positive for the new strain of coronavirus — 42 of whom are repatriated citizens from a Diamond Princess cruise. That number has grown by two since Messonnier’s last count Tuesday, although the CDC was not immediately available to offer details on the additional cases.
More than 82,000 cases of coronavirus have been reported globally, and more than 2,700 people have died, with the majority in mainland China, the epicenter of the outbreak.
But public health leaders have repeatedly reminded residents that the health risk from the novel coronavirus to the general public remains low.
“While COVID-19 has a high transmission rate, it has a low mortality rate,” the state Department of Public Health said in a statement Wednesday. “From the international data we have, of those who have tested positive for COVID-19, approximately 80% do not exhibit symptoms that would require hospitalization. There have been no confirmed deaths related to COVID-19 in the United States to date.”
CDC officials have also warned that although the virus is likely to spread in U.S. communities, the flu still poses a greater risk.
Gostin said the news of potential silent transmission does not eliminate the possibility of containing the virus in the U.S. and preventing an outbreak.
“There are few enough cases that we should at least try,” he said. “Most of us are not optimistic that that will be successful, but we’re still in the position to try.”
Originally Posted by carlos3652:
Great question. I dont have the resources or the data to give you something that would solve this (and lets be honest, even if I had all those things, I probably wouldnt be able to as it is not my field of expertise).
We are in a Covid (non political) thread, so I would love to leave the government out of any solution.
I think too many here are focused on Unvaxxed vs Vaxxed. The comparisons between them and of course, all things equal of a singular person, having been vaxxed is beneficial to the end user in making sure their survival rate has better chances if and when they get Covid. I think that is proven.
That being said, not everyone is created the same, or has the same issues. The Vaxx maybe more harmful to some, than getting Covid. Thats a real possibility.
My personal circle has had brain clots from the J and J vaccine as well as other issues. Some, like my parents, are fine after having small side affects (My family came to the States to take the vaccine because there werent enough in Argentina)
Some already have had Covid and are immune (at least from the variant they had) - Not enough data
Some are naturally immune - Not enough data
Some are not getting the vaccination because they have certain religious beliefs.
Some are not getting the vaccination because of government trust (minorities)
Some are not getting the vaccination because they want to get pregnant or other issues and the clinical studies have not been able to be had for long term effects.
The variants are not coming from inside the US, so as far as I know Delta or Gamma or Lambda was not because of the unvaxxed in the US. (There are 100m maybe in the US, 5.4 billion worldwide?, what are the probabilities)
So I would stop blaming the unvaccinated in the US for things they have not caused. There is too much hate and finger pointing and white knighting.
* How about focusing on making sure our hospitals having what they need to support the extra influx during seasonality issues. We were not prepared to handled the extra load.
* How about focusing on better messaging (not fear porn or blaming) from our Health Professionals and transparency with the data (good or bad)
* How about focusing on the things we can control and stop blaming Red / Blue States for problems.
* Minorities are a real issue here. They have low vaccination rates. Help them get what they need by providing additional avenues.
I don't know, forcing people to take this vaccine is not the answer and dividing people or shaming people into doing it is also wrong.
Great points all around, thank you for the detailed (and rational) response.
Yeah, my mind lately goes straight to healthcare and some of the tough decisions that need to be made. I don't know that it's feasible for hospitals to have this kind of crazy influx in mind... I assume they make a shit ton of money and could certainly do more prep for outlier seasons, but if there's low season, high season, and then Covid is 5 times the resources as high season (not saying it is), it's not feasible to prepare for Covid (unless the demand will always be there, which it won't).
And in some places, Covid was several more ICU beds and probably a few more people... in other areas, it was renting out entire floors of buildings, much less all of the supply shortages across the country.
Not to argue a valid point, just thinking about how big of a problem that is to tackle.
...so, the way to help hospitals right now in hotspots is to either vaccinate more people or slow down the spread. And that's the real issue.
At this point (despite my laughing at the extremes in this thread), I really don't think the reasons behind being vaccinated or not vaccinated really matters. Yeah, there are some completely valid reasons to not get vaccinated and there are completely invalid reasons..... either way, we're headed down the same path as last year to at least some extent and that's the immediate need for resolution.
And those resolutions are going to include mask mandates, possibly proof of vaccinations, possibly requiring vaccinations for employment in certain industries/locations, possibly shutting down businesses if shit gets to that point, etc.
Just like you said, some people focus far more on the outrage and finger pointing and politics, etc.... but, this shit is going to happen if things continue to go badly, and those decisions are completely out of our control.
So, the bottom line is you're either vaccinated and should be able to do stuff and go places with no restrictions... or you're not vaccinated and you might have to deal with staying home. And that sucks for anyone who has a completely legitimate reason to not be vaccinated, but it's just the reality of the situation as far as I see it (and whether they'd lockdown for everyone would be included in that, in which case everyone who's vaccinated will have to deal with it, too). [Reply]
I hadn't really thought about the vaccine requirements in terms of people who have recovered from Covid, and my 30 second search uncovered this one article about it.
...that's one of the more interesting debates about all of this, IMO, because just like with the vaccine, it's not about whether you can get Covid again, but about your chances of being hospitalized for Covid the 2nd/3rd/nth time.
Granted, I think you'd still need a good reason not to get vaccinated beyond recovering from Covid, especially if the reality becomes proof of vaccine to do stuff. [Reply]
Originally Posted by Bearcat:
I hadn't really thought about the vaccine requirements in terms of people who have recovered from Covid, and my 30 second search uncovered this one article about it.
...that's one of the more interesting debates about all of this, IMO, because just like with the vaccine, it's not about whether you can get Covid again, but about your chances of being hospitalized for Covid the 2nd/3rd/nth time.
Granted, I think you'd still need a good reason not to get vaccinated beyond recovering from Covid, especially if the reality becomes proof of vaccine to do stuff.
I don’t think lockdowns are necessary.
I do think Hospitals can plan better by moving elective / non critical surgeries to non covid windows short term (seasonalities) plan for worst flu type seasons. I think long term you will see more and more people taking the vaccine as well.
Regardless. I do think the vaccine / boosters are the best option for high risk people. I just can’t get behind the mandate to force someone to do it. Especially for low risk people.
Because while the vaccines provide better protection vs Hospitalizations and Deaths vs the unvaccinated. You are still talking about a low rate of hospitalization/ deaths among the unvaccinated in certain age groups. [Reply]
Let's hope that the FDA gets this fully approved by Labor Day. My fingers are crossed that the approval will also reassure some that are still hesitant to get the vaccine. [Reply]
Originally Posted by phisherman:
Let's hope that the FDA gets this fully approved by Labor Day. My fingers are crossed that the approval will also reassure some that are still hesitant to get the vaccine.
I certainly hope so, but I'm betting they'll just latch onto another reason. [Reply]
Originally Posted by OnTheWarpath15:
I certainly hope so, but I'm betting they'll just latch onto another reason.
Eh, it's a spectrum. There are some for whom that really will be the thing that pushes then over. For others, nothing will. Unfortunately I don't think anyone knows how many there are in each of those groups. [Reply]
