There is no convincing data that pro sports teams have a substantially positive net economic impact on a city. There's no reason why they should settle for an expansion team when they can win a multi-billion dollar settlement that they could use for a tremendous amount of revitalization of the city. [Reply]
Originally Posted by 'Hamas' Jenkins:
There is no convincing data that pro sports teams have a substantially positive net economic impact on a city. There's no reason why they should settle for an expansion team when they can win a multi-billion dollar settlement that they could use for a tremendous amount of revitalization of the city.
The only clear and convincing argument that can be made for a pro sports team having net positive economic impact on a city is if the team was publicly owned and a stadium was paid for by the NFL(with all the benefits etc. going to the city, which won't happen).
Also, court date is officially happening:
Breaking: MO court of appeals denies NFL writ requesting trial be moved out of city of St. Louis. Trial will be held at Carnahan courthouse starting Jan. 10.
Rams owner Stan Kroenke offered $100 million to settle relocation lawsuit with St. Louis, per report
Here's why the city turned it down
By John Breech
With the NFL facing a major lawsuit in St. Louis and things starting to heat up from a legal perspective, it appears that Rams owner Stan Kroenke recently tried to put an end to the four-year lawsuit by offering a huge sum of money to settle the case.
According Front Office Sports, Kroenke made an offer of $100 million to the three entities that originally filed the lawsuit back in 2017: the city of St. Louis, St. Louis County and the Regional Convention and Sports Complex Authority.
Although that's a lot of money, it wasn't enough to settle the case.
The plaintiffs decided to turn the offer down, which now sets the stage for the case to go to court with the trial expected to begin on Jan. 10. The lawsuit, which was originally filed back in April 2017, lists all 32 NFL teams and their owners as defendants. However, Kroenke has become the face of the lawsuit for the NFL because the only reason it was filed was due to the fact that he decided to move the Rams out of St. Louis. The Rams played their final season in the city back in 2015 and then moved to Los Angeles for the 2016 season.
The lawsuit was filed because the plaintiffs feel the Rams "violated the obligations and standards governing team relocations" by moving the franchise. Basically, St. Louis feels that the Rams broke the NFL's relocation guidelines when they left and the other teams are at fault because they voted to let the Rams move.
The NFL has been taking hit after hit in this case, which is likely one reason why Kroenke made a settlement offer. For one, the plaintiffs were granted access to the financial records of several prominent people in the NFL, including league commissioner Roger Goodell; owners Kroenke, Jerry Jones (Cowboys), Robert Kraft (Patriots) and John Mara (Giants); and former Panthers owner Jerry Richardson. The NFL also got shot down recently when trying to get the case moved out of St. Louis.
The fact that Kroenke offered $100 million to settle likely isn't a coincidence since the offered number just happens to match the amount of money the city of St. Louis said it lost after the Rams left.
From the lawsuit:
"The move to Los Angeles harmed Plaintiffs. The City of St. Louis has lost an estimated $1.85 - $3.5 million each year in amusement and ticket tax collections. It has lost approximately $7.5 million in property tax. It has lost approximately $1.4 million in sales tax. It has lost millions in earnings taxes. The City of St. Louis will have lost over $100 million in net proceeds."
If the plaintiffs turned down $100 million, they likely did it because they feel they can get more. One reason St. Louis is likely so optimistic is because they might have Richardson on their side. The former Panthers owner said in 2015 that the St. Louis stadium proposal met the guidelines for keeping the team. According to Front Office Sports, the other owners are worried about what Richardson might say in his testimony. Although he's a defendant, he might not necessarily feel compelled to protect the NFL since the league forced him to sell the Panthers back in 2017 after the team was hit with allegations of workplace misconduct and sexual harassment.
According to ESPN, if the NFL loses the case, some owners fear that the judgement against them might end up being more than a billion dollars. Kroenke seems to be well aware that the number could get that high, which is another reason why he likely offered a $100 million settlement.
The downside for the NFL is that if it the judgement does get into the billions, we could see total chaos among ownership. A report from ESPN has suggested that Kroenke is trying to renege on his promise to pay millions of dollars related to the lawsuit. Kroenke has been covering the legal fees in the case, but he doesn't believe he's responsible for paying the settlement if the NFL loses the case. Kroenke is reportedly thinking about suing the league to get out of the indemnification agreement he signed when the Rams moved out of St. Louis following the 2015 season.
Basically, if this starts to look like a case the NFL isn't going to win -- and it's inching in that direction each day -- the situation could get ugly for Kroenke, the league and every other defendant named in the lawsuit. [Reply]
Originally Posted by chiefzilla1501:
That’s extremely disappointing. They have the nfl cornered. I would hope there’s more to this.
It would've taken years for this go through appeals and even then I'm not sure how much St. Louis would have been awarded. Legal fees would go up, too.
Originally Posted by duncan_idaho:
Looks like the city/county end up with $500M after the lawyers fees are paid off and the money spent to develop the stadium proposal.
I'm sure they won't fight tooth and nail over that. :-)
Win for the city, IMO. St. Louis stops looking like a petty ex to folks outside the region (that's the perception that seems to permeate), and it goes away before the other NFL owners run out of stall tactics.
I think this also sets up Kroenke to be the new Al Davis/villain owner of the NFL.
Which I don't understand this perception at all. Kroenke literally spoke to the media twice when he became majority owner in St. Louis- once after he became majority owner in 2010 and again after Fisher was named HC.
Aside from that, he was quiet. Never engaged personally with the community and let Demoff act as his mouthpiece on his behalf.
I'm not for public $ being spent on stadiums, but the effort to at least try still worked out and is why the city/county is getting $790 million. Oakland never tried(which is a reason why their suit was thrown out of court) and San Diego's effort failed after a vote.
I don't see the NFL returning to St. Louis in my lifetime, but who knows. I'd think the NBA would have a better chance at returning here, however, I don't see that happening unless the Blues ownership group was directly involved with acquiring a team. [Reply]
Originally Posted by Rams Fan:
It would've taken years for this go through appeals and even then I'm not sure how much St. Louis would have been awarded. Legal fees would go up, too.
Which I don't understand this perception at all. Kroenke literally spoke to the media twice when he became majority owner in St. Louis- once after he became majority owner in 2010 and again after Fisher was named HC.
Aside from that, he was quiet. Never engaged personally with the community and let Demoff act as his mouthpiece on his behalf.
I'm not for public $ being spent on stadiums, but the effort to at least try still worked out and is why the city/county is getting $790 million. Oakland never tried(which is a reason why their suit was thrown out of court) and San Diego's effort failed after a vote.
I don't see the NFL returning to St. Louis in my lifetime, but who knows. I'd think the NBA would have a better chance at returning here, however, I don't see that happening unless the Blues ownership group was directly involved with acquiring a team.
The possibility I’m hoping for is that this was kroenke weaseling out of this and forcing the nfl to deal with the rest. Which means the nfl is still on the hook. More importantly kroenke pisses off the entire nfl.
This would go through years of appeals. But good chance before then that jerry and krafts financials get scrutinized which is a nightmare scenario for the nfl. Not to mention all the questions around nfls antitrust laws. The nfl would be racing to settle this quickly. Which is why I can’t believe they wouldn’t hold out to settle more if this is all that comes of this. [Reply]
6) As for the air-the-dirty laundry argument, believe me I get it. But so much of it has been aired. Kroenke registering Rams as LA business in 2010. Demoff Adios M-Fer email. Richardson calling Grubman devious. Those who are paying attention saw the laundry, in full.
Looks like the city/county end up with $500M after the lawyers fees are paid off and the money spent to develop the stadium proposal.
I'm sure they won't fight tooth and nail over that. :-)
Win for the city, IMO. St. Louis stops looking like a petty ex to folks outside the region (that's the perception that seems to permeate), and it goes away before the other NFL owners run out of stall tactics.
I think this also sets up Kroenke to be the new Al Davis/villain owner of the NFL. [Reply]
Probably a good deal for st louis. I hope the other nfl owners resent kroenke over this and bend him over on anything he tries to do in the future. [Reply]
Originally Posted by tyecopeland:
Probably a good deal for st louis. I hope the other nfl owners resent kroenke over this and bend him over on anything he tries to do in the future.
They should steal the sickly weasel he uses as a rug. [Reply]
