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Nzoner's Game Room>***Official 2022-2023 NBA Thread***
dirk digler 04:02 PM 10-18-2022
Can't believe the regular season starts tonight. Just seemed like the Finals ended a couple weeks ago.



Philly vs Celtics: 6:30PM CST TNT

GSW vs Lakers: 9:00PM CST TNT
[Reply]
tyecopeland 05:42 AM 05-17-2023
According to the play by play, in the last 5 minutes lebron missed 2 free throws, 2 threes, 1 layup and had 1 turnover. 4 points, 2 assists, 2 rebounds. Tell me more about his clutch.
[Reply]
ARROW2 07:47 AM 05-17-2023
Originally Posted by tyecopeland:
According to the play by play, in the last 5 minutes lebron missed 2 free throws, 2 threes, 1 layup and had 1 turnover. 4 points, 2 assists, 2 rebounds. Tell me more about his clutch.


LOL
[Reply]
dirk digler 07:55 AM 05-17-2023
Originally Posted by KC_Connection:
Lakers take game 2 comfortably. That 4th quarter was a disaster for Denver and it was the product of a Lakers adjustment defensively that will not be easily handled.
The Nuggets scored 34 pts in the 3rd quarter and had 100 pts for the game at the end of the 3rd and scored a paltry 26 pts in the 4th.

The difference is the Lakers scored 20 more points in the 2nd half vs 1st half. They also shot 15% higher with the 3 ball then their playoff average and 6% higher for FG's while Denver played their normal game.

I also read that defense isn't something new for the Nuggets, the Wolves ran it with Goebert playing the AD role.
[Reply]
KC_Connection 10:36 AM 05-17-2023
Originally Posted by dirk digler:
I also read that defense isn't something new for the Nuggets, the Wolves ran it with Goebert playing the AD role.
Keeping in mind that Gobert is no AD, how did Denver adjust then?
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Pitt Gorilla 01:03 PM 05-17-2023
Was watching some videos yesterday about the defenses employed during the late 80s/early 90s and it was fascinating. Against the Jordan/Pippen Bulls, the perimeter was left almost completely wide open and the guys (Jordan, Pippen, Paxson) would NOT shoot. It was crazy. Literally wide-open 3pt jumpers and nobody seemed interested. The defense was packed as far into the lane as legally possible. I guess I'd forgotten how strange that period really was.
[Reply]
Mecca 01:05 PM 05-17-2023
Originally Posted by Pitt Gorilla:
Was watching some videos yesterday about the defenses employed during the late 80s/early 90s and it was fascinating. Against the Jordan/Pippen Bulls, the perimeter was left almost completely wide open and the guys (Jordan, Pippen, Paxson) would NOT shoot. It was crazy. Literally wide-open 3pt jumpers and nobody seemed interested. The defense was packed as far into the lane as legally possible. I guess I'd forgotten how strange that period really was.
Just a different game, teams didn't shoot the 3 all that much.
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Pitt Gorilla 01:07 PM 05-17-2023
Originally Posted by ChiefsCountry:
The biggest **** in the NBA gets to coach him. **** the Spurs.
I don't think I'd considered it going in, but it's the perfect situation. I've never liked the Spurs, but it's difficult not to appreciate how good they've been at developing talent, especially international guys.

Honestly, I was hoping my Thunder or even the Pacers could sneak up and grab the #1, but I really didn't want Houston or Detroit to have ANOTHER bite at the apple, after getting so many high picks recently. So really, it worked out about as well as it could have, with Victor in a perfect organization to achieve his potential. I don't like the Spurs at all, but I may watch them now.
[Reply]
Pitt Gorilla 01:09 PM 05-17-2023
Originally Posted by Mecca:
Just a different game, teams didn't shoot the 3 all that much.
It certainly wasn't due to lack of opportunity. I'll see if I can find the video, as it was nuts. Imagine Pippen, Paxson, and even Jordan with nobody CLOSE to them beyond 3. They had to actively not want to shoot it.
[Reply]
KC_Connection 01:35 PM 05-17-2023

These were the expectations for an 18 years old Lebron James

"First ballot Hall of Famer or bust" pic.twitter.com/0WyjONjUdI https://t.co/rmUGJgouZZ

— Mink Flow (@currypistonn) May 16, 2023


What a question. I'd say LeBron responded well over the next 20 years.
[Reply]
BigCatDaddy 01:50 PM 05-17-2023
This guy has bust written all over him. A perimeter-built Shawn Bradley.
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dirk digler 02:51 PM 05-17-2023
Originally Posted by KC_Connection:
Keeping in mind that Gobert is no AD, how did Denver adjust then?
Against the Lakers? From my cursory view they moved Gordan out to the 3 pt corner but he seemed to drive in a few times or actually he stayed down low which pulled AD in. Jokic had a couple of turnovers trying to make the pass inside.

https://www.theringer.com/nba/2023/5...3-nba-playoffs

Originally Posted by :
With a little less than six minutes remaining in Game 1 of the Western Conference finals, Los Angeles Lakers coach Darvin Ham pulled his team into a huddle and reconsidered the most important decision in this series: who, exactly, would guard Nikola Jokic. For the majority of the night, that responsibility had fallen to Anthony Davis—possibly the best defensive player in the world, aptly demonstrated by a first-half possession in which he walled up the two-time MVP in the post and ended a Jokic hook shot before it had even left his hand. It was an absolutely sensational play. It was also one of just five shots that Jokic would miss all game long, and a footnote to what would ultimately be a 34-point, 21-rebound, 14-assist masterpiece.

That sort of dominance demands adjustment. So Ham, as an alternative, gave the job of stopping an unstoppable force to Rui Hachimura. “I wanted to take A off as being the initial line of defense, and hopefully Rui could turn him and make him go east-west a little bit more,” Ham told reporters after the game. On the 10 trips down the floor when Hachimura checked Jokic in the half court, the Nuggets scored six total points. Denver’s freewheeling offense broke down—not because Hachimura had any top-secret strategy to counter Jokic, but because him bodying up the superstar center meant that Davis didn’t have to. The kicker: AD never really stopped guarding Jokic, either, even while technically minding Aaron Gordon. The postseason’s leading shot blocker just tracked every play at an intimidating remove, forcing Jokic to account for his presence.

The strategy worked, and yet it wasn’t enough. Denver held on for a 132-126 win, though at one point LeBron James—who was in full-on bully ball mode, with Jamal Murray in his sights—led a run that shaved the Nuggets’ double-digit lead all the way down to three. There’s fair reason for Denver to be concerned about the way things bogged down. “They were just free safety-ing with Anthony Davis and letting him man the paint and making it look really crowded,” head coach Michael Malone said. “Our execution can be better.” And it will be. Some playoff adjustments shift the tectonic plates of a series, altering the facts on the ground to the point of changing everything about how the games are played. Other adjustments really just amount to a temporary annoyance—distracting and maybe even disruptive, but only until the opposing team bothers to swat them away. The Lakers’ big strategic play in Game 1 edged closer to the latter than the former, which is how losing a game they once trailed by 20-plus points can still wind up feeling like a missed opportunity.

Throwing Hachimura at Jokic worked precisely because it was counterintuitive. Ham had said long before Game 1 began that AD would guard Jokic, and stuck with that approach even after the Nuggets scored 72 points in the first half. But all along, the Lakers had prepped out the option for this sort of alternate matchup, and in a desperate moment Ham tipped his hand. “It was a part of our game plan, and we talked about it before the game,” Hachimura said. “The coaches told me that I’m gonna guard Jokic, too.” And he still will, in Game 2 and beyond. But every time he does, the Lakers risk overexposing him. The change in coverage during Game 1 forced a buzz saw offense to stop, think, and overthink. Jokic passed out of a few scoring opportunities and tried to force the action in others. The rhythms of creating offense completely changed with Davis clogging up the paint.

“It may be something we go to in Game 2,” Davis said. “Obviously, we’ve gotta go back and look at the film.” Unfortunately for the Lakers, Jokic and his teammates will be digging into the tape, too—and they won’t find any coverage they can’t crack. It’s all a matter of knowing what’s coming. When the Nuggets watch this sort of stunted possession back in a film session, they’ll map out ways to better space the floor for the next time Jokic calls for a clear-out:

Gordon parking himself in the dunker spot isn’t exactly helping—just look at how Davis can drift all the way over to Jokic without giving up much of anything. Murray is understandably trying to position himself as an outlet against a potential double-team, but sets up so close to Jokic that he practically creates one instead. If the other Nuggets aren’t going to move while Jokic picks on Hachimura, they at least need to give him room to operate. And when they do get moving, they have to know where and how their openings will materialize. When Murray—who hit incredible shots throughout Game 1 en route to 31 points—sees a possession like this one in the light of day, his missed connection with Jokic will jump off the screen.

Even elite players can be tempted to rush when they’re figuring things out on the fly against a scrambling, high-level defense. In retrospect, Murray could have slow-played that opportunity by stringing out the defense off the dribble instead of taking the first decent look he could find. (Though with the way Murray was shooting, one can understand why he might.) Hachimura isn’t just a target for Jokic to batter in the post; he’s clumsy defending the pick-and-roll, too. But wayward possessions like this one below are even more glaring:

It’s one thing to miss a read in the heat of a moment, with the gaps blurred by scrambling bodies and flailing limbs. But all night long, Denver had been able to create open 3-pointers on demand just by putting Jokic at the top of the floor and running a shooter into a handoff. Dennis Schröder locks up Murray to keep him from getting that kind of opening, but rather than pivot into that same action with Kentavious Caldwell-Pope (who was 3-for-8 from distance) or Michael Porter Jr. (who was 3-for-6), Jokic whirled through traffic and threw up a shot that never had a chance.

For defenses with size to spare, it’s fairly common practice to station the most intimidating shot blocker away from the action, where they can cast the longest possible shadow. ”We saw it before,” Jokic said. “We saw it against Minnesota. We saw it even in the season.” The fundamental difference—and what made the fourth quarter so jarring for the Nuggets—is the master class timing and vertical explosion Davis brings to the back line. He doesn’t even have to leave the restricted area to toss back Jokic’s runner. He doesn’t even really have to load up to leap for it. Davis simply waits out the drive and the spin, knocking the ball back as if Jokic had hurled his shot against a wall.

“[Jokic] shoots 70 percent on those little short-range chip shots and floaters and hooks and little one-leg fadeaways,” Ham said. “He scores them at an amazing rate. The idea was just to get A behind him a little bit, and have A as that big, long arm just ready to contest over the top of Rui.”

There will be a clamor for the Lakers to start Hachimura in Game 2, especially after their smaller lineup got absolutely smoked in the series opener. It probably wouldn’t hurt, and it certainly can’t get much worse than losing the rebound battle 22-6 in the first quarter. But leaning on Hachimura to defend Jokic on anything resembling a full-time basis just isn’t a viable option. He spaces out too often. He loses focus on his positioning. Throw him into the fire and he’ll commit silly fouls and fail to line up correctly in transition and forget to box out. The unfortunate truth for the Lakers is that their best chance to slow Jokic down with Hachimura has already come and gone. Earlier in the game, it took Jokic all of a few minutes to figure out what kinds of shots he could get off against Davis. But once he got a feel for the one-on-one matchup, Jokic barely missed again. The same would be true for going at Hachimura—which is really just going at Davis from a different angle.

There’s real matchup shock in attempting to maneuver around a rim protector like AD, just as there is for the Lakers in trying to keep a playmaker like Jokic under wraps. When you’re one of one, no opponent is ever fully ready for you. They might know your moves, or where you like to operate, or what you hope to accomplish. It’s just impossible to know what it really means to try to stick with Jokic through every fake or to somehow get past Davis on a drive until they’re living it. Hachimura handled his first test against Jokic with remarkable poise, contributing to a degree that cannot be ignored. In doing so, however, Hachimura has given the Nuggets everything they need—the film, the familiarity, the flat-out urgency—to make sure it never happens again.

[Reply]
KC_Connection 03:06 PM 05-17-2023
No, against the Wolves. I'm interested to know what they did to adjust to Gobert doing that.
[Reply]
Chief Pagan 03:13 PM 05-17-2023
Originally Posted by Pitt Gorilla:
It certainly wasn't due to lack of opportunity. I'll see if I can find the video, as it was nuts. Imagine Pippen, Paxson, and even Jordan with nobody CLOSE to them beyond 3. They had to actively not want to shoot it.
It's hard to compare era's but it would be interesting to see Jordan if he had the openness and spacing to operate that today's three point shooters provide.
[Reply]
KC_Connection 03:16 PM 05-17-2023

"I went into the Western Conference Finals cautiously very optimistic. ... After watching Game 1, my caution is gone and my optimism is boundless. Boundless." ��

@getnickwright explains: pic.twitter.com/kgpQ2T7wBQ

— First Things First (@FTFonFS1) May 17, 2023

[Reply]
KC_Connection 04:10 PM 05-17-2023

I was in 7th grade when they was Hyping Bron on ESPN! Mf still at the top 20 years later … stop playing with dude bra… it’s gettin outa pocket

— Damian Lillard (@Dame_Lillard) May 17, 2023

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