Free Agent Signings:
Carlos Santana
Mike Minor
Michael Taylor
Ervin Santana
Top 10 Prospects:
1 Bobby Witt Jr., SS
2 Asa Lacy, LHP
3 Daniel Lynch, LHP
4 Jackson Kowar, RHP
5 Erick Pena, OF
6 Nick Loftin, SS
7 Kyle Isbel, OF
8 Khali Lee, OF
9 Jonathan Bowlan, RHP
10 Carlos Hernedez, RHP [Reply]
None of our prospects have peed a drop so far this year. Kowar sucked and lost to a winless pitcher last night; Lynch had three ineffective starts and was sent back down. Hernendez has done squat. Isbell couldn't stick. We probably won't see Witt until next year, or as a September call up at best. Not much help from our farm system this year. [Reply]
Yeah I didn't see anything that resembles starter quality pitching from Kowar last night. He kinda reminds me of Mendoza but unfortunately worse. [Reply]
Originally Posted by bringbackmarty:
Yeah I didn't see anything that resembles starter quality pitching from Kowar last night. He kinda reminds me of Mendoza but unfortunately worse.
Oh man if only the Giants had you on board they would have been smart enough to abandon Tim Lincecum after he got ROCKED in his first career start. [Reply]
Originally Posted by bringbackmarty:
Yeah I didn't see anything that resembles starter quality pitching from Kowar last night. He kinda reminds me of Mendoza but unfortunately worse.
I saw Mendoza one time at Fogo De Chao. He didn't eat the steak with ketchup, so that explains why he sucks. [Reply]
[QUOTE=Chiefspants;15701302]Oh man if only the Giants had you on board they would have been smart enough to abandon Tim Lincecum after he got ROCKED in his first career start.[/QUOTE
It was just one night, I get that. He didn't get rocked, he threw multiple wild pitches that cost us runs. He was nowhere near ready for the Major Leagues. It was a mistake to call him up this early. Did I say we should move on? No I did not. [Reply]
Originally Posted by Chiefspants:
Oh man if only the Giants had you on board they would have been smart enough to abandon Tim Lincecum after he got ROCKED in his first career start.[/QUOTE
It was just one night, I get that. He didn't get rocked, he threw multiple wild pitches that cost us runs. He was nowhere near ready for the Major Leagues. It was a mistake to call him up this early. Did I say we should move on? No I did not.
I say this a lot, but I'll say it again: player development is not a linear thing in MLB.
If a player with a sub-1.00 ERA and WHIP at AAA over a half-dozen starts at AAA, with consistent success at lower levels of the minor, exhibiting good control and flashing two plus pitches isn't ready for a shot at the major leagues, who is?
Kowar had a rough beginning and didn't handle his debut well. That's all last night means. He could continue to struggle or he could work through his emotions and start performing to his potential.
Look over to Detroit and the trends of Tarik Skubal's season for an example. He was awful his first few starts, adjusted to MLB a bit, and now is dominating. [Reply]
I say this a lot, but I'll say it again: player development is not a linear thing in MLB.
If a player with a sub-1.00 ERA and WHIP at AAA over a half-dozen starts at AAA, with consistent success at lower levels of the minor, exhibiting good control and flashing two plus pitches isn't ready for a shot at the major leagues, who is?
Kowar had a rough beginning and didn't handle his debut well. That's all last night means. He could continue to struggle or he could work through his emotions and start performing to his potential.
Look over to Detroit and the trends of Tarik Skubal's season for an example. He was awful his first few starts, adjusted to MLB a bit, and now is dominating.
I think fans here are less likely to give Moore lots of benefit of the doubt because nearly all of his pitching prospects have sucked. We were supposed to have pitchers in that first wave and well didn't... [Reply]
I think fans here are less likely to give Moore lots of benefit of the doubt because nearly all of his pitching prospects have sucked. We were supposed to have pitchers in that first wave and well didn't...
This is a valid point.
Where I'm holding out is in that first wave is that many of our young arms plateaued even before AAA, not even making it to the majors or underperformed when they did a few years late. The fact that this next generation is dominating in AAA and clearly have the stuff to be dominant is very encouraging. Them setting an MLB record for their draft class is a testament to how rare this class is (with an upside to be the staff of the 2015 Mets). If the worst case scenario is that we end up getting two #3 starters and two dominant bullpen arms, we'll be in great shape for the immediate future. [Reply]
I think fans here are less likely to give Moore lots of benefit of the doubt because nearly all of his pitching prospects have sucked. We were supposed to have pitchers in that first wave and well didn't...
I get that. Especially if they're not paying close enough attention to be aware of the drastic difference in draft strategy and development approach from the 2010 class and the more recent groups.
They're drafting different types of players (More advanced college guys rather than HS guys with projectability and upside). They're developing them entirely differently (no square peg/round hole stuff anymore. No trying to hammer every pitcher into being a fastball/curve/changeup guy). [Reply]
I think fans here are less likely to give Moore lots of benefit of the doubt because nearly all of his pitching prospects have sucked. We were supposed to have pitchers in that first wave and well didn't...
I’ll push back on this.
Our 2011 prospect list was *loaded* with quality pitching. Just look at this list:
4. Danny Duffy
5. Mike Monty
6. John Lamb
7. Jake Odorizzi
8. Jeremy Jeffress
9. Chris Dwyer
13 Louis Coleman
14. Aaron Crow
25. Will Smith
27. YORDANO VENTURA
others: Greg Holland
I defy anyone to find me another system that stacked with future MLB pitching talent.
I get that. Especially if they're not paying close enough attention to be aware of the drastic difference in draft strategy and development approach from the 2010 class and the more recent groups.
They're drafting different types of players (More advanced college guys rather than HS guys with projectability and upside). They're developing them entirely differently (no square peg/round hole stuff anymore. No trying to hammer every pitcher into being a fastball/curve/changeup guy).
So you're saying they abandoned the short-lived experiment of drafting every high school pitcher in Indianapolis. [Reply]
There are still lots of busts in there, but things wouldn't look nearly as bad if Yordano was still with us. That almost gets ignored sometimes. A young quality starting pitcher who was under team control.
Even with a group like we have now, you're basically hoping to find 1 or 2 front line starters. If you end up with the 91 Braves or 15 Mets you've basically lucked out. [Reply]
So you're saying they abandoned the short-lived experiment of drafting every high school pitcher in Indianapolis.
Yeah. That area scout is also not employed any longer.
Whenever I think about that draft, I think about the Moneyball scene with the scouts where the old scouts are all saying cliche things about players, except Moore and his executive team listen to them and take Russell and Watson.
In my mind, that's also the guy that convinced them to take Christian Colon instead of Chris Sale. :-) [Reply]
Wonder if he’s the same scout who brought us Gary Thurman, our top pick (Indianapolis North HS) in 1984 and top prospect a few years in BBA, who totally flamed out as a big leaguer [Reply]
Originally Posted by tk13:
There are still lots of busts in there, but things wouldn't look nearly as bad if Yordano was still with us. That almost gets ignored sometimes. A young quality starting pitcher who was under team control.
Even with a group like we have now, you're basically hoping to find 1 or 2 front line starters. If you end up with the 91 Braves or 15 Mets you've basically lucked out.
Ventura was the key to the whole thing. He is more than likely the ace of the staff and top 10 MLB pitcher by now. Duffy is your classic #3 with #2 stuff. [Reply]
