Originally Posted by Bwana:
Once again, don't come in this thread with some kind of political agenda, or you will be shown the door. If you want to go that route, there is a thread about this in DC.
Originally Posted by Dartgod:
People, there is a lot of good information in this thread, let's try to keep the petty bickering to a minimum.
We all have varying opinions about the impact of this, the numbers, etc. We will all never agree with each other. But we can all keep it civil.
Thanks!
Click here for the original OP:
Spoiler!
Apparently the CoronaVirus can survive on a inanimate objects, such as door knobs, for 9 days.
California coronavirus case could be first spread within U.S. community, CDC says
By SOUMYA KARLAMANGLA, JACLYN COSGROVE
FEB. 26, 2020 8:04 PM
The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention is investigating what could be the first case of novel coronavirus in the United States involving a patient in California who neither recently traveled out of the country nor was in contact with someone who did.
“At this time, the patient’s exposure is unknown. It’s possible this could be an instance of community spread of COVID-19, which would be the first time this has happened in the United States,” the CDC said in a statement. “Community spread means spread of an illness for which the source of infection is unknown. It’s also possible, however, that the patient may have been exposed to a returned traveler who was infected.”
The individual is a resident of Solano County and is receiving medical care in Sacramento County, according to the state Department of Public Health.
The CDC said the “case was detected through the U.S. public health system — picked up by astute clinicians.”
Officials at UC Davis Medical Center expanded on what the federal agency might have meant by that in an email sent Wednesday, as reported by the Davis Enterprise newspaper.
The patient arrived at UC Davis Medical Center from another hospital Feb. 19 and “had already been intubated, was on a ventilator, and given droplet protection orders because of an undiagnosed and suspected viral condition,” according to an email sent by UC Davis officials that was obtained by the Davis Enterprise.
The staff at UC Davis requested COVID-19 testing by the CDC, but because the patient didn’t fit the CDC’s existing criteria for the virus, a test wasn’t immediately administered, according to the email. The CDC then ordered the test Sunday, and results were announced Wednesday. Hospital administrators reportedly said in the email that despite these issues, there has been minimal exposure at the hospital because of safety protocols they have in place.
A UC Davis Health spokesperson declined Wednesday evening to share the email with The Times.
Since Feb. 2, more than 8,400 returning travelers from China have entered California, according to the state health department. They have been advised to self-quarantine for 14 days and limit interactions with others as much as possible, officials said.
“This is a new virus, and while we are still learning about it, there is a lot we already know,” Dr. Sonia Angell, director of the California Department of Public Health, said in a statement. “We have been anticipating the potential for such a case in the U.S., and given our close familial, social and business relationships with China, it is not unexpected that the first case in the U.S. would be in California.”
It is not clear how the person became infected, but public health workers could not identify any contacts with people who had traveled to China or other areas where the virus is widespread. That raises concern that the virus is spreading in the United States, creating a challenge for public health officials, experts say.
“It’s the first signal that we could be having silent transmission in the community,” said Lawrence Gostin, director of the World Health Organization Collaborating Center on National and Global Health Law. “It probably means there are many more cases out there, and it probably means this individual has infected others, and now it’s a race to try to find out who that person has infected.”
On Tuesday, the CDC offered its most serious warning to date that the United States should expect and prepare for the coronavirus to become a more widespread health issue.
“Ultimately, we expect we will see coronavirus spread in this country,” said Nancy Messonnier, director of the CDC’s National Center for Immunization and Respiratory Diseases. “It’s not so much a question of if, but a question of when.”
According to the CDC’s latest count Wednesday morning, 59 U.S. residents have tested positive for the new strain of coronavirus — 42 of whom are repatriated citizens from a Diamond Princess cruise. That number has grown by two since Messonnier’s last count Tuesday, although the CDC was not immediately available to offer details on the additional cases.
More than 82,000 cases of coronavirus have been reported globally, and more than 2,700 people have died, with the majority in mainland China, the epicenter of the outbreak.
But public health leaders have repeatedly reminded residents that the health risk from the novel coronavirus to the general public remains low.
“While COVID-19 has a high transmission rate, it has a low mortality rate,” the state Department of Public Health said in a statement Wednesday. “From the international data we have, of those who have tested positive for COVID-19, approximately 80% do not exhibit symptoms that would require hospitalization. There have been no confirmed deaths related to COVID-19 in the United States to date.”
CDC officials have also warned that although the virus is likely to spread in U.S. communities, the flu still poses a greater risk.
Gostin said the news of potential silent transmission does not eliminate the possibility of containing the virus in the U.S. and preventing an outbreak.
“There are few enough cases that we should at least try,” he said. “Most of us are not optimistic that that will be successful, but we’re still in the position to try.”
Originally Posted by RaidersOftheCellar:
Haven't really followed this thread or similar ones, but it's interesting to me that about 2/3 of France is opposed to the vaccines, but here you're treated like a bumbling know-nothing country bumpkin if you even have the slightest concern about it. Do we really think the average American is more sophisticated and knowledgeable than the average French person?
If only 2/3 of France had opposed something else in 1940... [Reply]
Originally Posted by Fish:
Opposed or not, France has vaccinated a higher percentage of their population than the US has. 52.90% of the population is vaxxed in France.
That's because they recently began requiring vaccination to essentially survive. Rate of vaccination was very low and then skyrocketed overnight. [Reply]
Originally Posted by RaidersOftheCellar:
That's because they recently began requiring vaccination to essentially survive. Rate of vaccination was very low and then skyrocketed overnight.
Nice, they had the balls to do it.... restaurants and travel requiring proof. :-) [Reply]
Originally Posted by O.city:
I would associate hearing differenlty, but that makes sense. I tend to not put a whole lot of weight on social media with medical stuff because of social media and such atleast until I can ask around about it.
Not sure how my wife has survived as a doctor having never referred to social media in her life. [Reply]
The microchip theory might be ridiculous, but there's nothing stupid about being hesitant at this point.
Big Pharma is the least-trusted industry in America (backed up by polls) and constantly faces lawsuits. Now they've rushed an experimental product to market without proper testing, and are immune to liability, yet for some reason it's considered dumb to not be first in line. Despite many of us having a 99.99% chance of surviving Covid.
People can downplay the side effects/deaths we've seen to this point, but no one has the slightest clue about longterm effects. Pretending that we do is far dumber than taking a wait and see approach. [Reply]
Originally Posted by RaidersOftheCellar:
The microchip theory might be ridiculous, but there's nothing stupid about being hesitant at this point.
Big Pharma is the least-trusted industry in America (backed up by polls) and constantly faces lawsuits. Now they've rushed an experimental product to market without proper testing, and are immune to liability, yet for some reason it's considered dumb to not be first in line. Despite many of us having a 99.99% chance of surviving Covid.
People can downplay the side effects/deaths we've seen to this point, but no one has the slightest clue about longterm effects. Pretending that we do is far dumber than taking a wait and see approach.
Here are the issues with that:
There have NEVER been any major long-term effects from any vaccine we've ever had. Ever. There is literally no historical precent for concern.
It's not experimental. The technique has been in development for decades. Just because it hasn't been deployed in this way in the past doesn't mean it's something out of Frankenstein.
Many of the same people who say they're concerned about the long-term effects of the vaccine have spent their entire lives smoking, drinking, and taking a plethora of other drugs without thinking about it. ALL drugs have possible side effects, but when you give one the label of "vaccine," people lose their minds about it.
As an individual, sure, your likelihood of dying is relatively low. But you're dooming us all to living with this shit forever. So I suppose if you love mask mandates, capacity limits, and events being cancelled, you have a point. Otherwise, you're just being selfish.
Originally Posted by RaidersOftheCellar:
The microchip theory might be ridiculous, but there's nothing stupid about being hesitant at this point.
Big Pharma is the least-trusted industry in America (backed up by polls) and constantly faces lawsuits. Now they've rushed an experimental product to market without proper testing, and are immune to liability, yet for some reason it's considered dumb to not be first in line. Despite many of us having a 99.99% chance of surviving Covid.
People can downplay the side effects/deaths we've seen to this point, but no one has the slightest clue about longterm effects. Pretending that we do is far dumber than taking a wait and see approach.
The rushed thing has been dismantled over and over. And yeah, they face lawsuits of FDA approved stuff that goes through long trials (5 years, IIRC), so I'm not sure what "rushed" has to do with it... they will most likely get approved and we would most likely not know about long term side effects for years.
And we're at 350 million doses given in the US and ~7-8 months in, so not exactly first in line at this point.
In theory, we should all wait 20 years, or at least 5-10... I mean, if nothing has happened in 6+ months, a year or two probably won't be significant either. :-)
End of the day, I don't care any longer.... if people don't feel like there's a great option to protect themselves and the mask mandates don't help the hospitals in the hotspots, then unvaccinated people should stay home so those areas don't have to lockdown completely.
Everything else at this point is just noise because none of us have any control over future lockdowns, but we all know what will cause the next one.
Originally Posted by :
Richard M Carpiano, PhD, a professor of public policy at University of California, Riverside, said part of the opposition to vaccine passports stems from many Americans not being used to thinking about what’s best for the community versus the individual.
“A lot of times [the discussion about mandates] gets spun as ‘I should be able to do whatever I want,’ but that’s really not the basis of our social contract in this country, which is: ‘You’re free to do things that you want, provided that they don’t harm other people,’” he said.
Originally Posted by RaidersOftheCellar:
The microchip theory might be ridiculous, but there's nothing stupid about being hesitant at this point.
Big Pharma is the least-trusted industry in America (backed up by polls) and constantly faces lawsuits. Now they've rushed an experimental product to market without proper testing, and are immune to liability, yet for some reason it's considered dumb to not be first in line. Despite many of us having a 99.99% chance of surviving Covid.
People can downplay the side effects/deaths we've seen to this point, but no one has the slightest clue about longterm effects. Pretending that we do is far dumber than taking a wait and see approach.
there doesn't seem to be as much hesitancy towards all the new drugs/vaccine released in the last ten years.
How long is long enough to wait when it come to long term side effects 5 years , 20 100, we already know that COVID has long term effects and vaccines in the past haven't shown to have any.
Yes this is new tech for vaccines but you make it sound like new medical tech has never out performed old tech there is a reason people don't come into hospitals asking to be treated like they did in 1800s.
If you don't trust american big pharma you could try the vaccines produced in china/russia/india . [Reply]
My entire family and I are fully vaccinated and I have no worries about it however I cringe at how some are so easily OK with it being required. Good Lord. [Reply]
Originally Posted by DaFace:
Here are the issues with that:
[list=1][*]There have NEVER been any major long-term effects from any vaccine we've ever had. Ever. There is literally no historical precent for concern.
You have some good points, and that's why it's a tough issue.
But how exactly can someone make this statement with any certainty? How would that be proven?
Plus, obviously, this is not a traditional vaccine. [Reply]
Originally Posted by jdubya:
My entire family and I are fully vaccinated and I have no worries about it however I cringe at how some are so easily OK with it being required. Good Lord.
Honest question: Do you feel the same way about HepB, DTap, IPV, MMR, chicken pox, and Tdap vaccines being required for school kids? [Reply]
