Originally Posted by Bwana:
Once again, don't come in this thread with some kind of political agenda, or you will be shown the door. If you want to go that route, there is a thread about this in DC.
Originally Posted by Dartgod:
People, there is a lot of good information in this thread, let's try to keep the petty bickering to a minimum.
We all have varying opinions about the impact of this, the numbers, etc. We will all never agree with each other. But we can all keep it civil.
Thanks!
Click here for the original OP:
Spoiler!
Apparently the CoronaVirus can survive on a inanimate objects, such as door knobs, for 9 days.
California coronavirus case could be first spread within U.S. community, CDC says
By SOUMYA KARLAMANGLA, JACLYN COSGROVE
FEB. 26, 2020 8:04 PM
The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention is investigating what could be the first case of novel coronavirus in the United States involving a patient in California who neither recently traveled out of the country nor was in contact with someone who did.
“At this time, the patient’s exposure is unknown. It’s possible this could be an instance of community spread of COVID-19, which would be the first time this has happened in the United States,” the CDC said in a statement. “Community spread means spread of an illness for which the source of infection is unknown. It’s also possible, however, that the patient may have been exposed to a returned traveler who was infected.”
The individual is a resident of Solano County and is receiving medical care in Sacramento County, according to the state Department of Public Health.
The CDC said the “case was detected through the U.S. public health system — picked up by astute clinicians.”
Officials at UC Davis Medical Center expanded on what the federal agency might have meant by that in an email sent Wednesday, as reported by the Davis Enterprise newspaper.
The patient arrived at UC Davis Medical Center from another hospital Feb. 19 and “had already been intubated, was on a ventilator, and given droplet protection orders because of an undiagnosed and suspected viral condition,” according to an email sent by UC Davis officials that was obtained by the Davis Enterprise.
The staff at UC Davis requested COVID-19 testing by the CDC, but because the patient didn’t fit the CDC’s existing criteria for the virus, a test wasn’t immediately administered, according to the email. The CDC then ordered the test Sunday, and results were announced Wednesday. Hospital administrators reportedly said in the email that despite these issues, there has been minimal exposure at the hospital because of safety protocols they have in place.
A UC Davis Health spokesperson declined Wednesday evening to share the email with The Times.
Since Feb. 2, more than 8,400 returning travelers from China have entered California, according to the state health department. They have been advised to self-quarantine for 14 days and limit interactions with others as much as possible, officials said.
“This is a new virus, and while we are still learning about it, there is a lot we already know,” Dr. Sonia Angell, director of the California Department of Public Health, said in a statement. “We have been anticipating the potential for such a case in the U.S., and given our close familial, social and business relationships with China, it is not unexpected that the first case in the U.S. would be in California.”
It is not clear how the person became infected, but public health workers could not identify any contacts with people who had traveled to China or other areas where the virus is widespread. That raises concern that the virus is spreading in the United States, creating a challenge for public health officials, experts say.
“It’s the first signal that we could be having silent transmission in the community,” said Lawrence Gostin, director of the World Health Organization Collaborating Center on National and Global Health Law. “It probably means there are many more cases out there, and it probably means this individual has infected others, and now it’s a race to try to find out who that person has infected.”
On Tuesday, the CDC offered its most serious warning to date that the United States should expect and prepare for the coronavirus to become a more widespread health issue.
“Ultimately, we expect we will see coronavirus spread in this country,” said Nancy Messonnier, director of the CDC’s National Center for Immunization and Respiratory Diseases. “It’s not so much a question of if, but a question of when.”
According to the CDC’s latest count Wednesday morning, 59 U.S. residents have tested positive for the new strain of coronavirus — 42 of whom are repatriated citizens from a Diamond Princess cruise. That number has grown by two since Messonnier’s last count Tuesday, although the CDC was not immediately available to offer details on the additional cases.
More than 82,000 cases of coronavirus have been reported globally, and more than 2,700 people have died, with the majority in mainland China, the epicenter of the outbreak.
But public health leaders have repeatedly reminded residents that the health risk from the novel coronavirus to the general public remains low.
“While COVID-19 has a high transmission rate, it has a low mortality rate,” the state Department of Public Health said in a statement Wednesday. “From the international data we have, of those who have tested positive for COVID-19, approximately 80% do not exhibit symptoms that would require hospitalization. There have been no confirmed deaths related to COVID-19 in the United States to date.”
CDC officials have also warned that although the virus is likely to spread in U.S. communities, the flu still poses a greater risk.
Gostin said the news of potential silent transmission does not eliminate the possibility of containing the virus in the U.S. and preventing an outbreak.
“There are few enough cases that we should at least try,” he said. “Most of us are not optimistic that that will be successful, but we’re still in the position to try.”
Originally Posted by MahomesMagic:
No, you are playing word games.
After the age of 5, I never went to an emergency room or a hospital. But in your world all these people are just going there for the fun of it..to drink Powerade.
Who in their right mind wants to go to a hospital for no reason?
And we do have people worked up by the media going to the emergency room because they think they have Covid when they have hayfever or a cold. But while those don't end up in hospital numbers I just explained how 50% of the Covid hospital numbers aren't Covid.
I promise you if the CDC started analyzing COVID by trips to the emergency department
Who knows what they know. Does VAERS and Vsafe suck? Yes. But that's all we have unless CDC has actual numbers of everyone in the hospital within time of taking a shot..but obviously if they had that they are hiding it.
Just like when Fauci and Walensky were doing the 99% vaccine propaganda when CDC's how internal surveillance showed May was 15% and going straight up, for people vaccinated in the hospital.
At this point I don’t even know what you are saying. This is why I can only talk about this on the forum in small doses.
An ER visit is not the same as a hospitalization, which is what you claimed. If you want to look at the serious Adverse event rate then look at it, I already posted it for you.
The motivator for someone’s trip to the emergency department really isn’t relevant here. The majority of people who go to the emergency department are not admitted to the hospital, so emergency department visit rate and hospitalization rate or not anywhere near the same.
My point of illustration was that if a kid has vasovagal syncope after the shot, i.e. he got nervous and passed out, they would likely go to the emergency department and get discharged. This is a known side effect of any vaccine and it has nothing to do with a specific vaccine and it is not a serious adverse event. You could say the same thing for fevers, muscle aches, sore arms, rashes. People go to the emergency department for all these things after vaccines.
Again I’m not saying that there are no serious adverse events for the vaccine I’m just saying that you cannot Use emergency department visit rates as demonstration of serious adverse events. [Reply]
Originally Posted by Bearcat: 2.5 million people get admitted to the hospital and 630k die: The numbers are clearly wrong based on this one study from May 2020 with a sample size of 200, and most of them were going to die anyway!
900 people out of 27 million doses show up to an ER after being vaccinated:
"you are out of your element Donny" GIF almost seems appropriate right about now. [Reply]
Originally Posted by SupDock:
At this point I don’t even know what you are saying. This is why I can only talk about this on the forum in small doses.
An ER visit is not the same as a hospitalization, which is what you claimed. If you want to look at the serious Adverse event rate then look at it, I already posted it for you.
The motivator for someone’s trip to the emergency department really isn’t relevant here. The majority of people who go to the emergency department are not admitted to the hospital, so emergency department visit rate and hospitalization rate or not anywhere near the same.
My point of illustration was that if a kid has vasovagal syncope after the shot, i.e. he got nervous and passed out, they would likely go to the emergency department and get discharged. This is a known side effect of any vaccine and it has nothing to do with a specific vaccine and it is not a serious adverse event. You could say the same thing for fevers, muscle aches, sore arms, rashes. People go to the emergency department for all these things after vaccines.
Again I’m not saying that there are no serious adverse events for the vaccine I’m just saying that you cannot Use emergency department visit rates as demonstration of serious adverse events.
You are focused on hospitalization vs visits but even if you say a good portion of these don't stick, the math still doesn't work for you at all.
And keep in mind that this article was very conservative. Every Covid hospitalization was counted even though we know those numbers are padded where about half are there for something else.
Even if you get super aggressive and say 50% of the people who go to emergency room or hospital don't stay you still have too much risk on the vaccine side.
Your contention that people got jabbed and are just going to the emergency room for sore arms isn't an argument. It's a statement of religious type faith. [Reply]
Originally Posted by SupDock:
The motivator for someone’s trip to the emergency department really isn’t relevant here. The majority of people who go to the emergency department are not admitted to the hospital, so emergency department visit rate and hospitalization rate or not anywhere near the same.
My point of illustration was that if a kid has vasovagal syncope after the shot, i.e. he got nervous and passed out, they would likely go to the emergency department and get discharged. This is a known side effect of any vaccine and it has nothing to do with a specific vaccine and it is not a serious adverse event. You could say the same thing for fevers, muscle aches, sore arms, rashes. People go to the emergency department for all these things after vaccines.
Again I’m not saying that there are no serious adverse events for the vaccine I’m just saying that you cannot Use emergency department visit rates as demonstration of serious adverse events.
Oh, 100% with kids and parents... I don't know if kids are having the same side effects to the same extent, but if I had a 5 year old who felt half as shitty as I did after my second shot, I'd at least give it a second thought of something being wrong.
And with a lot of parents... pfft, many would react by heading to the ER (not to say it's exactly right or wrong). I could even see parents who are vaccinated go through the thought process of..... well, I know it's just side effects and I felt really shitty for a day, but this is my 5 year old, and just to be sure.......
And then of course, add those who go to the ER for everything. [Reply]
Originally Posted by SupDock:
Far more than 50% get discharged From the emergency department without being admitted. The fact that you think this is super aggressive shows how uninformed you are. An adult admission rate of 26 percent would be high. Pediatric admission rates are lower.
...
I will likely delete this after a day or so because I don’t like to talk about what I do on CP
Can you provide some insight on the Covid hospitalization rates?
The data that comes out shows those are padded by about 50% anytime the for/with Covid numbers are available. [Reply]
I have an M.D. from Harvard. I am board certified in cardio-thoracic medicine and trauma surgery. I have been awarded citations from seven different medical boards in New England, and I am never, ever sick at sea. [Reply]