As I am sure many of y'all already know, a spinoff of "Breaking Bad" titled "Better Call Saul" will be airing in 2014. This is going to be a prequel to Breaking Bad and will be based on the character of Saul Goodman from "Breaking Bad."
I, for one, will be watching. I'm sure the majority of all of you other "Breaking Bad" fans will be as well. Might as well get the discussion going sooner rather than later.
So... what are your hopes, expectations and/or concerns with the show? Here are some of mine:
Hopes: I hope to see Saul do his thing in the courtroom. I hope to see strong, unique supporting characters. I hope to see Breaking Bad foreshadowing. I hope he has an intriguing paralegal and/or assistant. I hope to see Breaking Bad characters such as Fring, Mike, etc...whoever. I hope the show kicks ass.
Expectations: I don't expect it to be as good as "Breaking Bad" (because nothing else is, really), but I expect it to be good since Vince Gilligan is writing. I somewhat expect it to have an even balance of comedy and drama...since Saul undeniably provides a substantial amount of comedic relief in "Breaking Bad." I expect to see "courtroom Saul." I expect the "Breaking Bad" references and character cameos to be less than what I hope. If it isn't even a fraction as good as "Breaking Bad," I expect it to be better than 95% of everything else on TV, since there is some shitty shit on TV these days.
Concerns: I'd be a liar if I were to say that I didn't think this show has potential of flopping and certainly failing to meet the presumed high expectations of the audience. Don't get me wrong, I think it will be good... but I think it COULD suck if not executed properly. My main concern is Saul ultimately proving himself to be a "little dab will do ya" type of character, which would lead to a show centered around his character not working out. I am hoping that the character of Saul will not be so over-used and constantly over the top, that he becomes annoying to me, thus ruining his character for me altogether... Not saying I think this will be how it goes down...just saying I think there is a CHANCE of this being the case, which prompts me to believe that a strong supporting cast is VITAL in terms of the amount of success/quality this show will accumulate. All in all, I don't think VG will steer us in an unfortunate direction though...I think they'll pull it off.
Originally Posted by siberian khatru:
No, actually, I was considering writing a "Believe it or not, I'm defending Chuck" post along those same lines -- that Chuck was totally justified in doing what he did FOR THE FIRM. Does it skewer Jimmy too? Sure. But bottom line is, Chuck is a partner and he's doing what's right for his firm. And he did so not by lying or deceiving, nor did he impeach Kim's character. He simply said, hey, we've got the professional experience she doesn't, and the manpower to pay attention to myriad details (hence Jimmy's revenge with the docs). You should stay with us.
It was a perfectly legit sales job, not a con. I even explained that to my family after we watched it.
Yep! Tho' I can understand, how doing it to one's family when his firm doesn't need that account as they are successful and Kim brought the account originally, that it can be viewed as sleazy. Chuck has issues too. [Reply]
Originally Posted by BucEyedPea:
Yep! Tho' I can understand, how doing it to one's family when his firm doesn't need that account as they are successful and Kim brought the account originally, that it can be viewed as sleazy. Chuck has issues too.
Firms don't stay successful by deciding "They don't need" large accounts. And in all honesty Jimmy really had no skin in that game. It was between Kim and HHM [Reply]
That little stunt he's about to pull with the documents - that could easily be done by a first year and just as easily get brought back on the firm. In fact, I'd imagine most of the pleadings he'd be responsible for as a first year wouldn't be signed as him, they'd be signed as him 'for the firm' and as such, anything he does could easily come back directly on the firm and in fact, the firm would almost certainly take the bullets well before the first year associate would.
When it doubt, find the deepest pockets. HHM is absolutely the deeper pockets here.
And while he may not have pulled that exact stunt as a first year, he'd have pulled something. The client solicitation thing is the easiest one and perhaps that would've only been met with a tersely worded letter from the Bar. But that's not all the damage he could do; he could easily ensnare his employers.
But again, we're getting back to where I started this whole thing - there is no circumstance whereby Jimmy would've been hired into that firm given his pedigree. You aren't asking that Chuck not interfere with Jimmy - you're asking that Chuck do him favors. Jimmy's not a silk-stocking lawyer and HHM is absolutely a silk-stocking firm. If you're a partner there, you don't want him in your firm and if you're his brother you don't want the resentment that comes with forcing him into your firm over other far more qualified candidates.
He doesn't respect Jimmy, I'll concede. But if Jimmy would simply get out of Chuck's sandbox, Chuck would probably forget he even exists. But by practicing right under Chuck's nose and to some degree expecting favorable treatment from Chuck, he just gets Chuck's dander up.
I don't know how shit works at a law firm, but at a CPA firm, everything would be reviewed.
And if he didn't care, he wouldn't have thrown a bitch fit, and the whole monkey with a machine gun thing wouldn't have happened. It's hard to look at those scenes and argue indifference. [Reply]
Originally Posted by Buehler445:
I don't know how shit works at a law firm, but at a CPA firm, everything would be reviewed.
And if he didn't care, he wouldn't have thrown a bitch fit, and the whole monkey with a machine gun thing wouldn't have happened. It's hard to look at those scenes and argue indifference.
Like I said - he's not indifferent when Jimmy's playing in his sandbox.
If I shit on the rug in my livingroom - you probably don't care. If I shit on the rug in your livingroom, you'll probably have a stronger opinion on the matter.
I'm starting to think that Kim finds out about Jimmy's trip to Kinkos and leaves him. Jimmy then goes to the strip mall to eventually become Saul. [Reply]
Originally Posted by DJ's left nut:
Like I said - he's not indifferent when Jimmy's playing in his sandbox.
If I shit on the rug in my livingroom - you probably don't care. If I shit on the rug in your livingroom, you'll probably have a stronger opinion on the matter.
DJ, do you have a sibling that thinks you screwed them over?
Chuck is despicable, he didn't make it into the office one time to save a client or help out the office one time until he had the chance to screw his brother over. His one and only intent is to screw his brother over, his desire to do that is so strong that he can ignore all the other "medical" stuff. [Reply]
Originally Posted by Gonzo:
I'm starting to think that Kim finds out about Jimmy's trip to Kinkos and leaves him. Jimmy then goes to the strip mall to eventually become Saul.
the previews for next week seem to support this....
they pretty clearly seem to indicate he got caught. I'm sure the shit storm will spill over onto Kim. [Reply]
Originally Posted by Great Expectations:
DJ, do you have a sibling that thinks you screwed them over?
Chuck is despicable, he didn't make it into the office one time to save a client or help out the office one time until he had the chance to screw his brother over. His one and only intent is to screw his brother over, his desire to do that is so strong that he can ignore all the other "medical" stuff.
Well I can't get in her head, but it seems unlikely. We get along well and she's a doctor so not really in my sphere of influence anyway.
If that's the extent of your takeaway from this show, you're missing some damn good television. If you're still putting white hats and black hats on people this far into this series, I think you're missing some pretty complex stuff going on under the surface.
I also think you're assuming a great deal many things not actually in evidence right now. Let's not forget that his first journeys back into the office were WITH Jimmy and in so doing he is the one that put together the RICO action and got Jimmy one hell of a sweet deal on the Sandpiper referral; a class action suit that he could never have managed on his own. [Reply]
Originally Posted by DJ's left nut:
Well I can't get in her head, but it seems unlikely. We get along well and she's a doctor so not really in my sphere of influence anyway.
If that's the extent of your takeaway from this show, you're missing some damn good television. If you're still putting white hats and black hats on people this far into this series, I think you're missing some pretty complex stuff going on under the surface.
I also think you're assuming a great deal many things not actually in evidence right now. Let's not forget that his first journeys back into the office were WITH Jimmy and in so doing he is the one that put together the RICO action and got Jimmy one hell of a sweet deal on the Sandpiper referral; a class action suit that he could've managed on his own.
You have some good points in playing the devil's advocate on this, it just seems like there is something deeply personal to you in it.
Jimmy has a better heart than Chuck, but Chuck has better/more defined morals. Which brother is worse? In the world that we get to see I'd say that Chuck is worse. While it might be illegal to solicit the signatures from the elderly in the lawsuit, Jimmy is only trying to stick it to the man who clearly deserves it. And while it might be perfectly legal to risk death per his condition to keep their client, Chuck is only trying to keep his brother from being successful, who based on what I've seen in the show deserves to be able to find success. [Reply]
That little stunt he's about to pull with the documents - that could easily be done by a first year and just as easily get brought back on the firm. In fact, I'd imagine most of the pleadings he'd be responsible for as a first year wouldn't be signed as him, they'd be signed as him 'for the firm' and as such, anything he does could easily come back directly on the firm and in fact, the firm would almost certainly take the bullets well before the first year associate would.
When it doubt, find the deepest pockets. HHM is absolutely the deeper pockets here.
And while he may not have pulled that exact stunt as a first year, he'd have pulled something. The client solicitation thing is the easiest one and perhaps that would've only been met with a tersely worded letter from the Bar. But that's not all the damage he could do; he could easily ensnare his employers.
But again, we're getting back to where I started this whole thing - there is no circumstance whereby Jimmy would've been hired into that firm given his pedigree. You aren't asking that Chuck not interfere with Jimmy - you're asking that Chuck do him favors. Jimmy's not a silk-stocking lawyer and HHM is absolutely a silk-stocking firm. If you're a partner there, you don't want him in your firm and if you're his brother you don't want the resentment that comes with forcing him into your firm over other far more qualified candidates.
He doesn't respect Jimmy, I'll concede. But if Jimmy would simply get out of Chuck's sandbox, Chuck would probably forget he even exists. But by practicing right under Chuck's nose and to some degree expecting favorable treatment from Chuck, he just gets Chuck's dander up.
So let Mesa Verde walk and he's out of Chuck's hair. [Reply]
Originally Posted by DJ's left nut:
The firm was about to lose a million dollar client - you think he only cared because Jimmy was involved? Hell, the first thing he did was scold Howard for letting Kim get away. The guy that plays Chuck did a great job of emoting disappointment in Howard when Howard said that she left - he clearly recognizes Kim's talent and potential to be a big-time asset at the firm.
I don't think he was trying to sabotage Kim at all; he was trying to get their client back and that's exactly what you'd expect from an 'of counsel' founding partner for a firm.
**** this - I'm starting a one man squad: Team Chuck. I expect no allies, but someone's gotta protect the guy from you wolves that think he ties his shoes in some manner expressly designed to irritate and undermine Jimmy.
Jimmy does just fine blowing himself out of the water without any intervention from Chuck and he'd have absolutely done it one way or the other. The dude's just slimy. He's done at least 3 things in a season and a half that would have him outright dis-barred. If Chuck were really out to hang him, it wouldn't be hard at all to go to the NM Bar and report him for ethics violations. All Jimmy has done is reinforce Chuck's distrust of him.
The thing is, had it been any other million dollar client. Chuck wouldn't have come in. He wouldn't have jeopardized his health, he would have just sat on his couch whining in his stupid little space jacket. He knows Kim and Jimmy are going into business together, and it's more not letting his brother "win" in his eyes. [Reply]
Originally Posted by Great Expectations:
You have some good points in playing the devil's advocate on this, it just seems like there is something deeply personal to you in it.
Jimmy has a better heart than Chuck, but Chuck has better/more defined morals. Which brother is worse? In the world that we get to see I'd say that Chuck is worse. While it might be illegal to solicit the signatures from the elderly in the lawsuit, Jimmy is only trying to stick it to the man who clearly deserves it. And while it might be perfectly legal to risk death per his condition to keep their client, Chuck is only trying to keep his brother from being successful, who based on what I've seen in the show deserves to be able to find success.
Again, I disagree with the issue that Chuck was trying to stick it to Jimmy with Mesa Verde. They were Kim's clients, not Jimmy's and in practice Chuck was really trying to keep a valuable new revenue source from being poached. [Reply]
Originally Posted by raybec 4:
Again, I disagree with the issue that Chuck was trying to stick it to Jimmy with Mesa Verde. They were Kim's clients, not Jimmy's and in practice Chuck was really trying to keep a valuable new revenue source from being poached.
Then why didn't Chuck step foot in the office for many years prior to Jimmy showing up? He didn't seem to care about gaining or losing clients this deeply before.
There is no other plausible explanation other than trying to stick it to Jimmy. His desire to stick it to Jimmy is the only thing powerful enough in his mind to overcome his "illness" and attend the meeting with the lights/cell phones/other electrical obstacles. [Reply]
Originally Posted by BWillie:
The thing is, had it been any other million dollar client. Chuck wouldn't have come in. He wouldn't have jeopardized his health, he would have just sat on his couch whining in his stupid little space jacket. He knows Kim and Jimmy are going into business together, and it's more not letting his brother "win" in his eyes.
I'm not going to concede that point.
He had already started taking meetings at the office. And again, when Sandpiper came along, he went into the office WITH Jimmy because he knew Sandpiper was a whale of a case and a potentially massive revenue stream.
We've seen nothing from Chuck to indicate he's anything other than an aggressive rainmaker for his firm.
This show is well-written enough that the characters are acting just as I would expect someone in their shoes to act. Any 'of counsel' partner, especially one as proud and badass as Chuck, would've dragged his ass into that meeting after his junior partner came in and was essentially giving up on retaining a million dollar client. [Reply]
