Mahomes has a very good argument for BOAT ("Best of all time") just as MJ does due to his peak level.
But GOAT? That ship has sailed for MJ at this point. LeBron is in year 20, shattering records and posting 30-9-7. It's not even close at this point. [Reply]
Originally Posted by staylor26:
If Mahomes had more championships than Brady in that time span, it wouldn't be a silly argument you ****ing reerun.
Nice self own though.
Championships are largely irrelevant to this discussion. If Mahomes played on teams with defenses that were as good as Brady had for his entire career, he'd win a SB just about every year. He's that much better than anybody who has ever played the game. But he doesn't have Brady's luck in that regard and likely never will.
Likewise, if LeBron fell into having the best team in NBA history form around him in Cleveland or anywhere else, he'd have easily won 6+ by now given his longevity. It's what makes the rings discussion such nonsense. [Reply]
The only people who I see coping today are MJ fans lashing out defensively after LeBron broke one of the most important records in basketball history. [Reply]
Originally Posted by KC_Connection: Championships are largely irrelevant to this discussion. If Mahomes played on teams with defenses that were as good as Brady had for his entire career, he'd win a SB just about every year. He's that much better than anybody who has ever played the game. But he doesn't have Brady's luck in that regard and likely never will.
Likewise, if LeBron fell into having the best team in NBA history form around him in Cleveland or anywhere else, he'd have easily won 6+ by now given his longevity.
Literally only a Lebron Stan could come up with this horseshit.
When you have to start off by saying this, you've already lost. [Reply]
Originally Posted by staylor26:
Literally only a Lebron Stan could come up with this horseshit.
When you have to start off by saying this, you've already lost.
If/when Tom Brady ends up with 7 (I'm still not buying that that POS is actually retired BTW) and Mahomes ends up with 3-4 at the end of his, I can't wait to hear this same garbage from you and all the others. [Reply]
Statistically and talent wise Lebron is the best in history by a gajillion miles.
I’m still taking prime jordan over prime lebron. For the same reasons I’m taking Montana over Marino. Apart from maybe gretzky and tiger woods, Mj had an unmatched killer instinct. I ragged on Lebron for this early in his career, but he did eventually become a stone cold killer. But it still doesn’t match MJs. That’s not a knock on lebron. We are talking GOAT level not just for basketball but for all sports.
What’s unique about Lebron is that he forced owners to give in to his every demand. And from that standpoint I feel like he was too pushy about keeping his friends close. Engineered trades he shouldn’t have and hand picked and held on to too many players longer than he should have. MJ was lucky in many regards to have a coach and (early on) a front office that complemented him. But I also tend to think Lebron would’ve made Phil Jackson’s life a living hell too. [Reply]
Originally Posted by KC_Connection:
Championships are largely irrelevant to this discussion. If Mahomes played on teams with defenses that were as good as Brady had for his entire career, he'd win a SB just about every year. He's that much better than anybody who has ever played the game. But he doesn't have Brady's luck in that regard and likely never will.
Likewise, if LeBron fell into having the best team in NBA history form around him in Cleveland or anywhere else, he'd have easily won 6+ by now given his longevity. It's what makes the rings discussion such nonsense.
Totally disagree. Rings mean everything IMVHO. Up to the last couple of SB wins by Brady I and many others still considered Montana the GOAT and it wasn't because of his stats. It was because in the biggest games he showed up and delivered and was undefeated 4-0 in the SB. [Reply]
Originally Posted by dirk digler:
Totally disagree. Rings mean everything IMVHO. Up to the last couple of SB wins by Brady I and many others still considered Montana the GOAT and it wasn't because of his stats. It was because in the biggest games he showed up and delivered and was undefeated 4-0 in the SB.
If rings mean everything, I assume you'll be prepared to say Tom Brady is the GOAT to the end of your days then? Because as much as I'd love to see it, Patrick Mahomes sure as hell isn't winning seven of those. [Reply]
Originally Posted by AdolfOliverBush:
Kareem Played forever and held the career scoring record for many years, but pretty much nobody considers him the GOAT.
LeBron is a more evolved Karl Malone, but he never would've enjoyed the longevity he has in an era when the NBA was less soft.
mmm, they did consider KAJ the GOAT before the coming of MJ. I still remember several times during games at the end of KAJ's career and the announcers would spend a couple minutes talking about it.
The primary problem with the whole GOAT discussion is that the definition is pretty much up to whoever's making the argument. So we get the Rings POV, the longevity POV, the career stats POV, etc.
Bottom line, LeBron has the hardware and the career accomplishments.
But if I were drafting a team to win a series and I could pick either in their primes, I'm taking MJ every single time, for one simple reason: MJ is an assassin that wants the last shot in the biggest moment at the end of a 7th game, and LeBron is not. [Reply]
Originally Posted by AdolfOliverBush:
Kareem Played forever and held the career scoring record for many years, but pretty much nobody considers him the GOAT.
LeBron is a more evolved Karl Malone, but he never would've enjoyed the longevity he has in an era when the NBA was less soft.
LeBron has dominated in like 3-4 vastly different eras of basketball at this point over his 20 year career, but sure he definitely couldn't have played 10 years earlier when everyone was in much worse physical shape and far less athletic than they are today. [Reply]
Originally Posted by Megatron96:
mmm, they did consider KAJ the GOAT before the coming of MJ. I still remember several times during games at the end of KAJ's career and the announcers would spend a couple minutes talking about it.
Of course some people did, but he was rarely the best player on his own team, let alone the GOAT. [Reply]
Originally Posted by KC_Connection:
If/when Tom Brady ends up with 7 (I'm still not buying that that POS is actually retired BTW) and Mahomes ends up with 3-4 at the end of his, I can't wait to hear this same garbage from you and all the others.
I will never say that championships are irrelevant.
And again, football and basketball are two different animals. It's really an apples to oranges comparison. [Reply]