So there's an article on NFL network saying that Orlando Brown is expected to sign for 6 years $145 mil.
That comes to $24.16 mil/yr and makes him the highest paid offensive lineman in football. It also would give him the 19th highest salary per year in the NFL
How would you feel if that is the contract he ended up signing?
I'm fine with it. He is a top 5 LT and he's only 26 next season. A young great LT is a guy you can't let leave. [Reply]
Originally Posted by Chief Pagan:
Is there a good reason to think that Brown will agree to a structure where he can be cut after the third year without too big of a dead cap hit?
Is that what the other big name LT's have agreed to in recent contracts?
I can’t recall who mentioned it earlier but there was a proclamation that it would end up being where the amount of guaranteed money OBJ is looking for would come in those first three years with voidable future years.
I’m not sure exactly what Browns side is requesting but I do think KC is sitting pretty enough cap-wise to take a significant hit these next two years while relying on draft capital to be the main source of talent infusion as opposed to FA. That third year is where I think he’s on the trade market with the OT of the future beginning their transition into LT. By that time he’ll be a bigger name in the league due strictly to affiliation with this offense/team and someone else will want to acquire it to “shore up” their OL. I think Veach will flip him for profit moreso than cut him outright. [Reply]
Originally Posted by DJ's left nut:
Yeah - screw anything that actually happened on the field last night; lets just make shit up instead!
You know who had the highest pass block win rate in the entire NFL this year? Yeah, the Chiefs. And no, Mahomes mobility has nothing to do with that stat. A pass block win is determined by how long the O-lineman holds his block. It's just a straight up eval of the play in question.
The Chiefs were first at a 75% win rate. The gap between them and 2nd place was 7 points. Which was the same gap as the distance between 2nd place and 15th.
Can we stop just flat making shit up when we have these discussions? There are genuine conversations to be had as to the cap math and the risks associated with overpaying for anyone. But to just make up nonsense in support of a position makes the entire conversation a waste of time.
You're using a stat for the entire offensive line to support one player? You realize just how good our interior 3 have been at pass rush win rate, surely. I don't think you can accuse people of making shit up when you're attempting to use stats that don't actually support your argument either. You have always been better than this with your arguments and analysis.
Brown is nowhere near as terrible as Wylie, that is obvious. That doesn't make Brown good in his own right though. He clearly gave up too much pressure this season. I'm concerned with his growth so far as a pass-blocker.
If you want us to support your cause, I think you need to present a different argument. I do think a massive upgrade at RT would help the team play away from Orlando's deficiencies but that's going to still require a high pick because there isn't a really good pass-blocking RT in free agency.
There are clear upgrades to Wylie in free agency, but the price tags will likely be much higher than they are worth too. I'm not going to pay 16-19 million for guys like Jawaan Taylor, Mike McGlinchey or Kaleb McGary and I'm guessing that's what it will take.
I'd be interested in Taylor if you can get him in that 10m range. I think he's a guy on the ascent but he still draws too many flags and isn't quite where you want as a pass blocker. He's young enough to continue working with but he scares me a little bit.
Overall, your best argument for keeping OBj is that it makes it significantly easier to improve the offensive line because you only now need a RT. Spend a high pick on one and get a stud there and you're set up much better for the future. What you better make absolutely sure of is that you're getting a really good pass blocker at RT. Pat works better rolling to his right and it also allows Pat a safety net when OBj does lose to speed.
That said, you have the other argument that your brought up of drafting your LT this year and playing him at RT, then getting your RT next year. That could work. You might also draft both this year and let one learn on the bench while the other plays RT. In this case you tag OBj and he walks next year.
A big reason I'm incredibly high on Syracuse's Matthew Bergeron is that he's played both sides at a high level and is functionally interchangeable. If he shows he can be an NFL LT, problem solved. If he isn't, he's most likely going to be a really good RT. He's the guy I'd target at 31.
Just fix the fucking O-Line somehow, in whatever way works best. So long as I don't see Wylie starting another game here, I'm happy as shit. I can live with Brown as much as I dislike his play. [Reply]
Originally Posted by Chief Pagan:
Is there a good reason to think that Brown will agree to a structure where he can be cut after the third year without too big of a dead cap hit?
Is that what the other big name LT's have agreed to in recent contracts?
I don't know why everyone here keeps thinking OBJ will be so reasonable and accommodating. He only forced his way out of Baltimore over this and caused a lot of annoyance here over the same issue.
-He's not moving to RT
-He wants to be paid like a top tier LT
-He wants a significant portion of that guaranteed
Nothing he's shown in the past 3 years has given any indication that he's willing to budge off that. If we (God willing) win the superbowl then he certainly isn't coming down from any of those demands.
Tag and trade for a 2nd or maybe even a 1st then trade up and grab whoever you actually want there. An actual LT who fits this offense. [Reply]
Originally Posted by Imon Yourside:
So many of us love to be wrong, gotta pay the man.
Really no reason to be wrong in the first place on this one; OBJ has been solid most of the season. Zero idea why he gets so much hate on here. [Reply]
Originally Posted by IowaHawkeyeChief:
and replace him with whom?
Zero people have given a good answer to this question. If KC doesn't retain Brown, I'm sure beach has as plan. But I'm betting they work pretty damn hard to make it work. [Reply]
Originally Posted by Pitt Gorilla:
Zero people have given a good answer to this question. If KC doesn't retain Brown, I'm sure beach has as plan. But I'm betting they work pretty damn hard to make it work.
People haven't given an answer of your liking perhaps. Most calls for him to be replaced are to do so by moving up in the 1st and drafting a new LT. If you don't think that a "good answer," then you're entitled to that opinion. The problem with expecting some other answer than that or re-signing him is the other two options are more unsettling; trading for and paying top dollar to a better one or signing one in free agency that's at least no better than Brown.
At the end of the day, I feel like it comes down to re-signing OBj or drafting his replacement. The Chiefs probably do sign OBj long-term. It's a passable idea so long as they upgrade at RT. I'm not delusional enough to think Wylie's performance tonight dismisses everything he did up to this point. I equivocally have reservations about signing OBj to a big contract. I would tag him and not sign him until I could see how the draft does shake out. If a good LT falls, I think I'd pounce on it. It saves KC a lot of money for the next 5 years and they could see an uptick in pass blocking at the position. If a LT doesn't fall, go ahead and sign him and live with his flaws but do try to get much better at RT. [Reply]