Originally Posted by Rainbarrel:
No one will sign him until after the 4th of July. Too strong of a possibility someone mistakes him for a turtle. Then shove am M80 up his butt
Originally Posted by Couch-Potato:
btw Hopkins had 717 yards in 9 games last year.
Because he was literally the only option when he played. He was targeted 96 times in those 9 games. JJSS was targeted only 5 more times than Hopkins, but he played in 16 games and not 9. Those 717 yds in 9 games isn't anywhere near as impressive as people want to act like it is and is really just proof of how bad/injured Arizona was last year. [Reply]
Originally Posted by Rainbarrel:
No one will sign him until after the 4th of July. Too strong of a possibility someone mistakes him for a turtle. Then shove am M80 up his butt
Originally Posted by Mephistopheles Janx:
I don't know that teams bereft of talent and who had a losing record (Panthers and Jets) having to overpay to bring talent / names (Thielen) are in the same position we find ourselves in.
Gage's cap hit in 2023 is $7m to MVS's $9m. Gage also had 51 receptions on 70 targets for 5 TDs. MVS had 42 receptions on 81 targets with 2TD last season.
Coming into their respective contracts... MVS put up 430 yards on 26 receptions off 55 with 3 TDs targets while Gage put up 770 yards on 66 receptions off 94 targets and 4TDs.
With Gage coming up on a $16m payday next season due to the way that 3-30 contract was written up... I would be shocked if he is still with the Bucs next season.
7m > 9m
First, name all the FAs the Chiefs have signed the last few seasons at a clear discount to the market because we’re a winning organization. I’m very excited to see your list.
Second, we signed MVS in the third wave of FA because we had traded Hill and needed to re-tool the WR room. We didn’t have a surplus of options.
Third, you’re not even looking at contracts in a remotely sensible or comparable way. Both MVS and Gage signed for 3/30mm. MVS got 8.5mm at signing and then 6.5mm if on the roster for 2023. Total 15mm at 7.5mm/yr for 2yrs or 8.5mm/1yr. Gage got 15mm at signing and then 5mm if on the roster for 2023. Total 20mm at 10mm/yr for 2yrs or 15mm/1yr.
Originally Posted by dlphg9:
Because he was literally the only option when he played. He was targeted 96 times in those 9 games. JJSS was targeted only 5 more times than Hopkins, but he played in 16 games and not 9. Those 717 yds in 9 games isn't anywhere near as impressive as people want to act like it is and is really just proof of how bad/injured Arizona was last year.
Lol, like somehow it was Hopkins fault that he was the only option. Wildly silly take.
"JJSS was targeted only 5 more times than Hopkins, but he played in 16 games and not 9."
JJSS had the best QB in history throwing to him, entirely 1v1 all season. DH had three of the worst QBs in the league throwing to him, and yes, they force-fed him the ball because no one else proved to be reliable enough to count on. And yet, even doubled for much of the season, he still caught 64 balls for 717 yards.
It took JJSS 16 games to accumulate a less than stellar 933 yards, and managed just a measly 2 TDs, with Mahomes throwing him open, in Andy's scheme.
If DH had played the 6 suspended games (15 total games), he projected to eclipse 1,200 yards, even with those shitty QBs struggling to get him the ball.
Gee, I wonder what Hopkins could've done if he'd had a good QB throwing the ball?:-) [Reply]
Originally Posted by Rainbarrel:
No one will sign him until after the 4th of July. Too strong of a possibility someone mistakes him for a turtle. Then shove am M80 up his butt
Originally Posted by penguinz: BEP level of stupidity.
Originally Posted by :
I don't think MVS is as negative as you make him out to be, as he showed in the AFC Championship game that he can fill the other facets of this offense if he has to, plus he very much fulfills his role. If he didn't have some concerns in dropping the ball and had an extra step in his lateral movement, he'd be a lot better player (but he'd also cost an additional 6 to 10M AAV)
Plus, it's important to remember that he was literally our 2nd option at receiver last year (so realistically 3rd behind Kelce) and got 687 yards.
Lets look at some beautiful data:
He was 55th in yards amongst all pass catchers (46th amongst Wide Receivers only), making him an average WR2 in the grand scheme of things, in an offense where realistically he is the 3rd option (if we go off of qualified players in Receiving Yds per game he fares a bit worse at 68th, or the 55th Wide Receiver making him an average WR2 option or a top 3rd pass catcher)
So lets run with his worse set of numbers, looking at guys around him in terms of production output last year (In terms of Yards per game), we see veteran receivers like Corey Davis (62nd), Mack Hollins (66th), Curtis Samuel (71st). If we include other pass catchers we also add Zach Ertz (67th), Dalton Schultz (72nd) and Tyler Higbee (76th)
Lets look at salaries...
Corey Davis 12.5M AAV
Mack Hollins Vet Minimum, had no other season historically over 223 yards
Curtis Samuel 11.5M AAV
Zach Ertz 10.5M AAV, Tight End signed 2022 (Same year as MVS)
Dalton Schultz Rookie Deal, was playing on 5th year Option @ 10.9M, Tight End
Tyler Higbee 7.25M AAV, Tight End signed 2019
MVS 10M AAV.
For comparative production from a WR, MVS actually cost comparatively than the veteran receivers around his production. Not a great deal by any means, but not the albatross that you're making it out to be. In fact, one could claim compared to those counterparts on that list and the fact their contracts were written before the Christian Kirk contract and before MVS contract, one could claim that his contract is cheaper than it should be.
I'm not going to argue that, but it's not an albatross and he's not awful like you're attempting to make him out to be.
I understand your position and I thank you for the added context.
Career catch %:
Corey Davis (team with losing record) - 59.2
Mack Hollins (team with losing record) - 58.9
Curtis Samuel (team with losing record) - 64.7
Zach Ertz (TE on team with losing record) - 67
Dalton Schultz (TE on team with winning record but still on rookie deal) - 70.1
Tyler Higbee (TE on a team with a losing record) - 68
MVS (#2 WR on a SB winning squad with GOD as his QB) - 50.3 (51.9 with Mahomes)
I get it... this is one stat of many but it is, arguably, one of the most important stats for a receiver. How often does he catch the balls thrown to him.
Perhaps saying he is overpaid is an exaggeration. How about we leave it at I just don't trust him as anything other than a 4th option. I have more faith in Kelce/Rice/McKinnon as the first 3 receiving options than I do MVS.
I want to eat crow. I hope be balls out and you all get to quote me for the next 5 years on this. I never want our players to fail but I'm not gonna put on rose colored glasses regarding players solely because they wear our logo.
I hope you all see something in him that I'm missing but he seems like a whole lot of meh. [Reply]
someone is gonna give him a pretty large deal you would think but maybe not. It would be nice if he just wanted to come get a ring but his window for getting big contracts is closing fast so I would imagine he's going where the money is. [Reply]
Soooo....for anyone using Tenor for gifs, look at the code. See this section here? ""host" data-aspect-ratio="1" data-width="100%">
Change the 100% to like, 30% or so and the Gif will be normal size rather than gigantamus.
(Credit to one of hte mods for showing me that. Either Bearcat or Bowser i dont recall which). [Reply]
