So there's an article on NFL network saying that Orlando Brown is expected to sign for 6 years $145 mil.
That comes to $24.16 mil/yr and makes him the highest paid offensive lineman in football. It also would give him the 19th highest salary per year in the NFL
How would you feel if that is the contract he ended up signing?
I'm fine with it. He is a top 5 LT and he's only 26 next season. A young great LT is a guy you can't let leave. [Reply]
Originally Posted by DJ's left nut:
Y'all wanna know how many rookie Ts have been better than Orlando Brown Jr this year? Maybe - MAYBE - one. Braxton Jones. And Jones isn't a great pass protector despite an offense that makes pass protection quite a bit easier than KC's does (not unlike Baltimore's did).
Lucas has been pretty good at a low cost - but not better than Brown. Likewise with Cross. Tyler Smith has been bad. Ekwonu has been bad. Evan Neal has been one of the worst Ts in all of football and he was a top 10 selection and pretty widely regarded as a damn good pick/prospect there.
3 OTs taken in the top 10 this year and nary a one of them has been better than OBJ. And the FA market is a steaming pile of shit. And the Packers aren't letting Nijman get away - he's getting a 2nd round tender at least - he might get a 1st round tender and even THEN they might just match the damn thing.
Y'all that are just acting like we can run on down to the Tackle store and find an above average LT are simply ignoring the lack of availability of the position.
A tag and trade is my backup option for a reason - it's NOT going to make this team better next year and likely won't for the next couple. And those are hugely important years given that the clock is ticking on Elite Kelce and the prime years of Chris Jones.
And I think you can expand that going back a few years, too. Mekhi Becton? Andrew Thomas? Etc.
Finding a LT who can play as well as Brown is lately is not easy. Even when you have premium draft options.
Now, if his play gets uneven again and drops to what it was early this year (when he was possibly hurt or not in form due to the holdout) then that's a more replaceable player.
Originally Posted by DJ's left nut:
I don't mind 4 years of effective guarantees at about $22 million/season with some filler thrown in to get him to like $25 million.
So, what's that amount to? 6/$150 w/ the last two years being at like $29 and $33 million or something equally silly.
Admittedly, it's reaching my puke point. AND it's contingent on him continuing to play well (as I have noted that I believe he HAS played well the last 5+ weeks).
That absolutely re-sets the T market. It's the highest in practical guarantees ever offered by a ton. It's the highest AAV ever offered. It's the highest total value. It's a new standard at T.
And it's going to cost us, what, $6 million more against the cap than he made this year on average? $2 million more than he'd make on the tag for a single season? A figure that will flip on its head as early as year 2 of the deal?
It's an enormous deal but it's a deal that won't seem so enormous as quickly as the 2nd year. And do I think he'd sign it? Yeah, I do. And if he doesn't - well shit folks, who here is saying to hand him a blank check?
And if he goes back to playing like he did in weeks 2-4, it's all moot because again, as I said, I'm happy a decision doesn't have to be made now because it's pretty much impossible to do so. There's a LOT of time left here, folks.
Yup. You're en pointe on all of this, IMO. [Reply]
Originally Posted by duncan_idaho:
And I think you can expand that going back a few years, too. Mekhi Becton? Andrew Thomas? Etc.
Finding a LT who can play as well as Brown is lately is not easy. Even when you have premium draft options.
And if the Chiefs had drafted Abraham Lucas or Braxton Jones and put him at RT to similar results to what their respective teams are getting, I'd be okay taking a small step down at LT and moving them over because the difference is SO vast.
But we didn't do that. And you can't count on that. Those are either happy accidents or products of desperation. And more often both. [Reply]
Originally Posted by duncan_idaho:
And I think you can expand that going back a few years, too. Mekhi Becton? Andrew Thomas? Etc.
Finding a LT who can play as well as Brown is lately is not easy. Even when you have premium draft options.
Now, if his play gets uneven again and drops to what it was early this year (when he was possibly hurt or not in form due to the holdout) then that's a more replaceable player.
Yup. You're en pointe on all of this, IMO.
His inconsistency is what will kill his future in KC since he wants to be paid like the best.
This shit will happen every year, and this is playing for a contract. Knowing how proud he is being the most unathletic player in the NFL, he'll have zero work ethic and will phone it in when he gets paid.
Darrisaw was the guy I wanted if we didn’t get a deal done for Silverback or a trade for Orlando. He’s been pretty good and a big reason Minnesota has been better on offense.
It can be done, but we would be trading 2 firsts and another pick to make that move up and then would go through rookie year struggles during a season we’re competing for a title and if it doesn’t work out, that changes EVERYTHING.
They need to take what Orlando’s demand was last year (from his own mouth was 25m per aav) and add in the increase percentage to the overall cap and write the check so they can focus on getting a deal done with Chris Jones that keeps him in KC for 4 more years (but make it a 5 year extension on paper) and an extension done with Sneed. [Reply]
Originally Posted by Superturtle:
I'm sorry, but what? He played like fucking shit against the Titans.
fake news
Originally Posted by Tribal Warfare:
His inconsistency is what will kill his future in KC since he wants to be paid like the best.
This shit will happen every year, and this is playing for a contract. Knowing how proud he is being the most unathletic player in the NFL, he'll have zero work ethic and will phone it in when he gets paid.
He's Left Tackle Frank Clark
Can we put the “inconsistency” thing to rest for now?
Year 1 in KC it took a few weeks to acclimate to the difference in systems and by midseason was kicking ass.
During contract negotiations, Brett Veaches reservations about a top of market deal for Orlando was his weight and how that weight directly affects his potential in the offense to be compensated like that. So, Orlando took it to heart and lost a TON of weight and then had to modify his whole technique to be effective at the lower weight.
He struggled to find his effectiveness in the first month by battling an injury while changing his whole approach to the game. But he has a good work ethic snd has transformed himself.
Look at him play the last month and then look at him play last year. It’s a completely different person/player.
This version is good enough to give any pass rushers a good fight.
Last year, his tool box was far more limited. [Reply]
Can we put the “inconsistency” thing to rest for now?
Year 1 in KC it took a few weeks to acclimate to the difference in systems and by midseason was kicking ass.
During contract negotiations, Brett Veaches reservations about a top of market deal for Orlando was his weight and how that weight directly affects his potential in the offense to be compensated like that. So, Orlando took it to heart and lost a TON of weight and then had to modify his whole technique to be effective at the lower weight.
He struggled to find his effectiveness in the first month by battling an injury while changing his whole approach to the game. But he has a good work ethic snd has transformed himself.
Look at him play the last month and then look at him play last year. It’s a completely different person/player.
This version is good enough to give any pass rushers a good fight.
Last year, his tool box was far more limited.
:-) Did you REALLY just say it was 'fake news' to call that game by Brown 'fucking shit', where he allowed 6 pressures, and then turn around and write a novella of fanfiction about how the only caveat Veach had to giving Brown a massive LTD was weight management?!? :-) That's honestly fucking hilarious. Well played. [Reply]
:-):-):-):-):-) You do realize weight clauses can be included in NFL contracts, right? The even bigger Brown had them in his contracts with the Patriots. [Reply]
Originally Posted by DJ's left nut:
And if the Chiefs had drafted Abraham Lucas or Braxton Jones and put him at RT to similar results to what their respective teams are getting, I'd be okay taking a small step down at LT and moving them over because the difference is SO vast.
But we didn't do that. And you can't count on that. Those are either happy accidents or products of desperation. And more often both.
Don't be silly Abraham Lucas was anything but a happy accident. The only happy accident there was him actually slipping to the top of the 3rd round. His play absolutely was noticed and most grades were late 1st to mid 2nd. Hell, I think the idiots across the pond were even high on him. Last year was a weird deal with some guys like him and Travis Jones inexplicably slipping despite a pretty stacked top 50.
I did really want Braxton Jones in the 4th last year damn it. He's exactly the type of player to take a flier on with hopes he is a "happy accident." He had all the athletic ability in the world and a good performance, just competition level. [Reply]
Originally Posted by kccrow:
Don't be silly Abraham Lucas was anything but a happy accident. The only happy accident there was him actually slipping to the top of the 3rd round. His play absolutely was noticed and most grades were late 1st to mid 2nd. Hell, I think the idiots across the pond were even high on him. Last year was a weird deal with some guys like him and Travis Jones inexplicably slipping despite a pretty stacked top 50.
I did really want Braxton Jones in the 4th last year damn it. He's exactly the type of player to take a flier on with hopes he is a "happy accident." He had all the athletic ability in the world and a good performance, just competition level.
Sure he was - at least to a certain extent.
The Seahawks took Boye Mafe and a RB ahead of him. Hell, they took another TACKLE ahead of him who's worse than he is.
If the Seahawks expected him to be this guy, a day 1 starting OT, they don't take a RB when they already had Rashaad Penny and risk losing him. They damn sure don't take an overaged rookie DE w/ mediocre college production ahead of him.
I'm not saying they didn't think he could be a quality player - but if they put a higher value on Boye Mafe and Kenneth Walker than they did Abraham Lucas, then yes - there's an element of good fortune here. [Reply]
Originally Posted by DRM08:
I said $100 million fully guaranteed, which is 55% higher than Stanley's guaranteed money. $100M guaranteed for Orlando is a pretty damn generous offer considering Stanley is a far better player than Orlando.
I do no reading comprehension. I whiffed totally on the 100M guaranteed part and thought you were just saying to stick your foot in the ground at 21m per and he should take it. My bad.
100M guaranteed, that's probably too high for my liking. I don't like the Stanley contract I referenced either, but I could live more with the 65m guaranteed than 100m guaranteed.
Here's what I'd consider a likely offer based on demands IMO.
Mr. Orlando...
We'll give you a 6-year deal worth $139.50m ($23.25m per) that includes:
2023 $35.00m signing bonus
2023 salary of $2.50m guaranteed at signing
2024 salary of $6.75m guaranteed at signing
2025 salary of $18.25m guaranteed at signing
2026 salary of $19.00m guarantees on the 5th day of the league year
2027 salary of $20.00m with $10.00m that guarantees on the 5th day of the league year
2028 salary of $27.50m
Pro Bowl incentives (LTBE right now) of $1.25m in each year of the deal
A $500k Workout bonus in each year of the deal
This brings the contract in with $62.50m guaranteed at signing (44.8%) and total potential guarantees of $91.50m (65.6% that puts him in line with Stanley).
Cap hits are 11.25, 15.50, 27.00, 27.75, 28.75, 29.25.
Yes: Sign Here
No: Your agent is welcome to work a deal and trade once we slap that tag on you again muddafucka.
Reference Trent Williams contract was:
6-year (if options executed), $138.06m with $30.1m signing bonus ($40.1m guaranteed at signing or 29.1%, but really ends up $55.2m or $40% to trigger the entire 6 years)
Salary guarantees of $1.55, 7.25, and 1.25m in 2021, 2022, and 2023.
An additional $5.05m salary guarantee for 2023 that guarantees on April 1, 2022.
An optional $10.0m salary guarantee option for 2023 that triggers years 2024-2026 due by April 1, 2023. [Reply]
