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Nzoner's Game Room>***NON-POLITICAL COVID-19 Discussion Thread***
JakeF 10:28 PM 02-26-2020
A couple of reminders...

Originally Posted by Bwana:
Once again, don't come in this thread with some kind of political agenda, or you will be shown the door. If you want to go that route, there is a thread about this in DC.
Originally Posted by Dartgod:
People, there is a lot of good information in this thread, let's try to keep the petty bickering to a minimum.

We all have varying opinions about the impact of this, the numbers, etc. We will all never agree with each other. But we can all keep it civil.

Thanks!

Click here for the original OP:

Spoiler!

[Reply]
petegz28 06:31 AM 06-30-2020
Originally Posted by DaFace:
My issue is that this is NOT the decision that is being made. There are no 8 year olds dying that the 80 year olds have to save. The kids are fine.
That's why I have a major issue with this whole idea that it's acceptable to not care as much because they're old.
All you are doing is tossing out a straw man. I don't know anyone who is saying that at all. You asked why someone would view the difference between an 0 year old dying and an 8. If you can't grasp that then that's on you but that doesn't mean people don't care about older people.
[Reply]
Donger 06:32 AM 06-30-2020
So another day with over 40,000 new cases and people are still arguing about masks.

Makes sense.
[Reply]
Monticore 06:40 AM 06-30-2020
No symptoms, big problems: Scientists still puzzled by asymptomatic coronavirus cases


http://www.msn.com/en-ca/news/techno...gNb9&ocid=iehp

Dr. Jorge Mercado, a pulmonologist and critical care doctor at New York University's Langone Hospital-Brooklyn, said scientists still aren't sure why some people who have been exposed to the virus get very sick, while others develop no symptoms.

"We really don't know much about this disease," he said. "We know a little more than we did three months ago, but there are still a lot of things we don't have answers to

In CT scans of all the study participants, the researchers found signs of lung inflammation, known as pulmonary infiltrates, even in people who showed no symptoms. Signatures of inflammation were observed in 57 percent of the asymptomatic group

It makes you wonder if they really were asymptomatic, because clearly they had some pneumonia," he said. "It just goes to show that the absence of symptoms is not the absence of infection."

Until we know how much transmission asymptomatic people are responsible for, it makes an incredible amount of sense to keep stressing that everyone should wear a mask," she said. "If you happen to be in that category and you're wearing a mask, that's going to keep you from infecting people and putting those viral particles out in the environment. And everyone else wearing a mask is doing the same for you
[Reply]
BigCatDaddy 06:40 AM 06-30-2020
Originally Posted by DaFace:
My issue is that this is NOT the decision that is being made. There are no 8 year olds dying that the 80 year olds have to save. The kids are fine.
That's why I have a major issue with this whole idea that it's acceptable to not care as much because they're old.
I've always said we need to protect nursing homes. However if I was a high risk individual I would rather have a higher risk of getting Covid than have my kids and grandkids deal with years of economic issues because of it. BUT that's just me being unselfish.
[Reply]
BigCatDaddy 06:43 AM 06-30-2020
Originally Posted by DaFace:
Not sure how you interpret "80 year olds dying abd 8 year olds dying doesn't have the same impact." That sounds like "they're old so screw them" to me.
Lay off the alcohol bro.
[Reply]
petegz28 06:52 AM 06-30-2020
Originally Posted by BigCatDaddy:
I've always said we need to protect nursing homes. However if I was a high risk individual I would rather have a higher risk of getting Covid than have my kids and grandkids deal with years of economic issues because of it. BUT that's just me being unselfish.
The ones who appeared to "not care about old people" are the Governors that put people who had Covid into nursing homes. Again, the report I cited the other day showed nearly half of the deaths are linked to nursing homes. That means about 60,000 people died both old and young in large part by the actions of some governors that didn't care about old people.
[Reply]
dirk digler 06:53 AM 06-30-2020
Originally Posted by Donger:
So another day with over 40,000 new cases and people are still arguing about masks.

Makes sense.

No kidding plus it seems we still have to explain the timeline of how Covid 19 progresses from infection to death 4 months into this pandemic. This isn't instantaneous it takes a month to 6 weeks or longer.
[Reply]
petegz28 06:59 AM 06-30-2020
Originally Posted by dirk digler:
No kidding plus it seems we still have to explain the timeline of how Covid 19 progresses from infection to death 4 months into this pandemic. This isn't instantaneous it takes a month to 6 weeks or longer.
That would go against what we have seen thus far. Again, the data is what it is, not what you want it to be. And at no time during the initial surge in cases did we see deaths decline. At no time. Deaths increased daily with cases and didn't decline until cases started to decline. Sure there is some lag but you can't revise things to be what they aren't because you want to make some kind of point.

Will the downtrend in deaths continue? Let's hope so. We certainly are seeing a divergence between deaths and cases at the moment anyway and you should be hoping it stays that way.
[Reply]
DaFace 07:03 AM 06-30-2020
Originally Posted by petegz28:
That would go against what we have seen thus far. Again, the data is what it is, not what you want it to be. And at no time during the initial surge in cases did we see deaths decline. At no time. Deaths increased daily with cases and didn't decline until cases started to decline. Sure there is some lag but you can't revise things to be what they aren't because you want to make some kind of point.

Will the downtrend in deaths continue? Let's hope so. We certainly are seeing a divergence between deaths and cases at the moment anyway and you should be hoping it stays that way.
Someone grab the crayons.
[Reply]
OrtonsPiercedTaint 07:04 AM 06-30-2020
If they will not wear a mask. You are free to throw your used tires in their yard.
[Reply]
tyecopeland 07:06 AM 06-30-2020
My county had an outbreak at a 'boys home". Tripled our covid cases. All but two of our 20 something active cases are attributed to that place, 3 are spouses of workers.
[Reply]
Donger 07:07 AM 06-30-2020
Originally Posted by dirk digler:
No kidding plus it seems we still have to explain the timeline of how Covid 19 progresses from infection to death 4 months into this pandemic. This isn't instantaneous it takes a month to 6 weeks or longer.
Deaths lag infection? You're talking crazy.

I suppose we can "hope" that the majority of these new cases are younger people and the death numbers won't be as high. But how many of them infected the non-young? It's not like just because you are young, the R0 is less than one.
[Reply]
BigCatDaddy 07:11 AM 06-30-2020
Originally Posted by Donger:
Deaths lag infection? You're talking crazy.

I suppose we can "hope" that the majority of these new cases are younger people and the death numbers won't be as high. But how many of them infected the non-young? It's not like just because you are young, the R0 is less than one.
Lags 6 weeks or more? No.
[Reply]
dirk digler 07:13 AM 06-30-2020
Originally Posted by petegz28:
That would go against what we have seen thus far. Again, the data is what it is, not what you want it to be. And at no time during the initial surge in cases did we see deaths decline. At no time. Deaths increased daily with cases and didn't decline until cases started to decline. Sure there is some lag but you can't revise things to be what they aren't because you want to make some kind of point.

Will the downtrend in deaths continue? Let's hope so. We certainly are seeing a divergence between deaths and cases at the moment anyway and you should be hoping it stays that way.

I hope it stays that way as well but from the very beginning everybody says deaths lags by weeks. That is why the recovered number barely goes down because it takes a long time to either die or recover. The people that are dying today got infected a month ago.

Come Aug 1 we should have a better idea of those positive cases that has happened in the last couple of weeks.


Originally Posted by :
Deaths are the ultimate lagging indicator, especially with Covid-19. It takes several weeks after a diagnosis for a patient to die. Then it takes more time, sometimes weeks, for doctors to fill out death certificates and health officials to adjudicate the deaths. Only then are they finally added to the official state tally.

“You can’t look at deaths as an indicator of where the outbreak is at this particular period of time,” said Amesh Adalja, a senior scholar at the Johns Hopkins Center for Health Security.

Waiting for data to roll in requires “patience that is hard to muster during a crisis,” said Joe Gerald, an associate professor of public health policy and management at the University of Arizona. But “if you want reliable, complete data, you have to wait for it, especially on deaths.”

In Arizona, the time between diagnosis and death from Covid-19 now is about 14 or 15 days, up from four or five days early in the pandemic. Then the state health department must verify the death, so there can be a three-plus week lag between a new case and a fatality being reported, Gerald said.

Half of the deaths reported for the week ending June 14 were more than a week old, so he expects it to take at least another week before he can reach any conclusions about the mortality rate for this surge. A modest bump could be expected with younger patients being hospitalized at a higher rate of hospitalization, Gerald said

[Reply]
Bearcat 07:15 AM 06-30-2020
Originally Posted by DaFace:
Not sure how you interpret "80 year olds dying abd 8 year olds dying doesn't have the same impact." That sounds like "they're old so screw them" to me.
What's another 10 or 20 years, anyway...
[Reply]
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