Originally Posted by Bwana:
Once again, don't come in this thread with some kind of political agenda, or you will be shown the door. If you want to go that route, there is a thread about this in DC.
Originally Posted by Dartgod:
People, there is a lot of good information in this thread, let's try to keep the petty bickering to a minimum.
We all have varying opinions about the impact of this, the numbers, etc. We will all never agree with each other. But we can all keep it civil.
Thanks!
Click here for the original OP:
Spoiler!
Apparently the CoronaVirus can survive on a inanimate objects, such as door knobs, for 9 days.
California coronavirus case could be first spread within U.S. community, CDC says
By SOUMYA KARLAMANGLA, JACLYN COSGROVE
FEB. 26, 2020 8:04 PM
The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention is investigating what could be the first case of novel coronavirus in the United States involving a patient in California who neither recently traveled out of the country nor was in contact with someone who did.
“At this time, the patient’s exposure is unknown. It’s possible this could be an instance of community spread of COVID-19, which would be the first time this has happened in the United States,” the CDC said in a statement. “Community spread means spread of an illness for which the source of infection is unknown. It’s also possible, however, that the patient may have been exposed to a returned traveler who was infected.”
The individual is a resident of Solano County and is receiving medical care in Sacramento County, according to the state Department of Public Health.
The CDC said the “case was detected through the U.S. public health system — picked up by astute clinicians.”
Officials at UC Davis Medical Center expanded on what the federal agency might have meant by that in an email sent Wednesday, as reported by the Davis Enterprise newspaper.
The patient arrived at UC Davis Medical Center from another hospital Feb. 19 and “had already been intubated, was on a ventilator, and given droplet protection orders because of an undiagnosed and suspected viral condition,” according to an email sent by UC Davis officials that was obtained by the Davis Enterprise.
The staff at UC Davis requested COVID-19 testing by the CDC, but because the patient didn’t fit the CDC’s existing criteria for the virus, a test wasn’t immediately administered, according to the email. The CDC then ordered the test Sunday, and results were announced Wednesday. Hospital administrators reportedly said in the email that despite these issues, there has been minimal exposure at the hospital because of safety protocols they have in place.
A UC Davis Health spokesperson declined Wednesday evening to share the email with The Times.
Since Feb. 2, more than 8,400 returning travelers from China have entered California, according to the state health department. They have been advised to self-quarantine for 14 days and limit interactions with others as much as possible, officials said.
“This is a new virus, and while we are still learning about it, there is a lot we already know,” Dr. Sonia Angell, director of the California Department of Public Health, said in a statement. “We have been anticipating the potential for such a case in the U.S., and given our close familial, social and business relationships with China, it is not unexpected that the first case in the U.S. would be in California.”
It is not clear how the person became infected, but public health workers could not identify any contacts with people who had traveled to China or other areas where the virus is widespread. That raises concern that the virus is spreading in the United States, creating a challenge for public health officials, experts say.
“It’s the first signal that we could be having silent transmission in the community,” said Lawrence Gostin, director of the World Health Organization Collaborating Center on National and Global Health Law. “It probably means there are many more cases out there, and it probably means this individual has infected others, and now it’s a race to try to find out who that person has infected.”
On Tuesday, the CDC offered its most serious warning to date that the United States should expect and prepare for the coronavirus to become a more widespread health issue.
“Ultimately, we expect we will see coronavirus spread in this country,” said Nancy Messonnier, director of the CDC’s National Center for Immunization and Respiratory Diseases. “It’s not so much a question of if, but a question of when.”
According to the CDC’s latest count Wednesday morning, 59 U.S. residents have tested positive for the new strain of coronavirus — 42 of whom are repatriated citizens from a Diamond Princess cruise. That number has grown by two since Messonnier’s last count Tuesday, although the CDC was not immediately available to offer details on the additional cases.
More than 82,000 cases of coronavirus have been reported globally, and more than 2,700 people have died, with the majority in mainland China, the epicenter of the outbreak.
But public health leaders have repeatedly reminded residents that the health risk from the novel coronavirus to the general public remains low.
“While COVID-19 has a high transmission rate, it has a low mortality rate,” the state Department of Public Health said in a statement Wednesday. “From the international data we have, of those who have tested positive for COVID-19, approximately 80% do not exhibit symptoms that would require hospitalization. There have been no confirmed deaths related to COVID-19 in the United States to date.”
CDC officials have also warned that although the virus is likely to spread in U.S. communities, the flu still poses a greater risk.
Gostin said the news of potential silent transmission does not eliminate the possibility of containing the virus in the U.S. and preventing an outbreak.
“There are few enough cases that we should at least try,” he said. “Most of us are not optimistic that that will be successful, but we’re still in the position to try.”
Originally Posted by Marcellus:
Neat, so thats the end of the conversation those people are the only opinions?
Not all opinions are equal. Period.
Hamas and Cdcox are very bright men who have experience in the field and/or a research background.
That I should value the opinion of a guy (not you particularly, but in general) who knows nothing about research or immunology at the same level is ludicrous. [Reply]
Originally Posted by cdcox:
At my university, a reduced level of research has been continued throughout the pandemic. We are starting to ramp up, still within a reduced level.
In the lab, more than 6 feet away: no facial covering required
In the lab, closer than 6 feet: facial covering required
In a common area like a hallway, stairway, etc: facial covering required
Every one is expected to disinfect shared items and commonly touched surfaces. Work at home if you can. The density of people in any building will be far less than a grocery store*. Just good common sense at work here. Yes, it takes a lot of effort to achieve. But this is the most serious situation we have faced as a nation since WWII. Greater than the housing crisis, 911, dot-com crash, gulf wars, Vietnam, Watergate, race riots, assassinations. Get with it people. No one is being asked to storm the beaches of Normandy here. Just mask up when you are in an indoor public area. We used to be able to pull together.
*RANT My only public outing since mid-march other than trying to get take out at Cheese Cake Factory on Mother's Day. It was a total disaster. Based on their web page, I expected my food would be ready in 35 minutes and curbside delivery. Sounds reasonable, I'm in. I pull up for curbside and they refuse to answer the phone. I finally go inside and there are 20 customers milling about the lobby. No one is in charge. No clear indication of how to find your food or how to tell anyone you are here. Ultimately, over an hour to get my food. I had to go inside 3 different times, and made several sarcastic, passive aggressive comments in a loud voice whenever I was inside. I think the "manager" ran away at one point rather than owning the situation. In the end they screwed my order over, which is the least of the offenses. In order of importance to me: 1) Don't advertise curbside service during a pandemic if you can't deliver. 2) Pick up the GD phone to tell me what is going on. 3) Have someone in charge when I walk inside against my will. 4) Anticipate a rush on Mother's day and staff accordingly. 5) Reflect accurate food-ready times on your app before you hold my money hostage. 6) Get my order right.
For the record, the Family Fare grocery store I usually go into is the least busy grocery store I've ever seen in my life. It's very easy to stay 6 feet away from other people. So I'm not going to waste a mask when I'm going in there. They're still a bit difficult to get so I feel like I have to be judicious on when I use one.
I don't disagree with anything else in your post, it's all very fair and sensible. And yes, if these restaurants want to stay in business, they need to get their shit together. I had a similar experience with Oklahoma Joe's last Saturday. I fucking love that place and want them to stay around and am perfectly happy with curbside takeout. But for crissakes, get more than one person working on the phone. That's a critical element in the process and without it, the system will break down. [Reply]
Originally Posted by oldandslow:
Not all opinions are equal. Period.
Hamas and Cdcox are very bright men who have experience in the field and/or a research background.
That I should value the opinion of a guy (not you particularly, but in general) who knows nothing about research or immunology at the same level is ludicrous.
My opinion actually has no bearing on what we or you actually do. Hamas and Cdcox are both very smart individuals. But thats just a couple of opinions.
One of my good friends is an anesthetist, my daughters mother is a nurse practitioner married to a doctor, etc...etc....everyone we know has opinions and they probably all differ to some degree.
My original point was calling people stupid assholes because they disagree on this is pretty fucking pretentious. The debate is not settled and I don't see how it could be when you see how this is all very different depending on where you live. [Reply]
Originally Posted by Marcellus:
My opinion actually has no bearing on what we or you actually do. Hamas and Cdcox are both very smart individuals. But thats just a couple of opinions.
One of my good friends is an anesthetist, my daughters mother is a nurse practitioner married to a doctor, etc...etc....everyone we know has opinions and they probably all differ to some degree.
My original point was calling people stupid assholes because they disagree on this is pretty ****ing pretentious. The debate is not settled and I don't see how it could be when you see how this is all very different depending on where you live.
There is also a difference between Dr Fauci and my wife when it comes to an opinion on this subject as well, I think my wife is a smart Doctor but I wouldn't take her word over an Epidemiologist/Respirologist on this subject . [Reply]
Originally Posted by oldandslow:
Not all opinions are equal. Period.
Hamas and Cdcox are very bright men who have experience in the field and/or a research background.
That I should value the opinion of a guy (not you particularly, but in general) who knows nothing about research or immunology at the same level is ludicrous.
This needs to be posted from time to time. [Reply]
Originally Posted by Monticore:
There is also a difference between Dr Fauci and my wife when it comes to an opinion on this subject as well, I think my wife is a smart Doctor but I wouldn't take her word over an Epidemiologist/Respirologist on this subject .
Sorry but Fauci has pulled a 180 on more than 1 topic during all of this so as smart as he is, his word alone is not the end all. [Reply]
Originally Posted by petegz28:
Sorry but Fauci has pulled a 180 on more than 1 topic during all of this so as smart as he is, his word alone is not the end all.
Originally Posted by Mecca: Also why in our society is it frowned upon to change your view when more information comes out?
I don't think digging your heels in and being a stubborn jackass is an admirable trait personally.
Then you should stop doing it as well as making assumptions.
Aside from your ridiculous straw man argument, no one is saying he isn't allowed to change his mind. The point is one man's word is not the gospel. [Reply]
Originally Posted by Halfcan:
So you are telling me all the people out in public wearing masks have not touched them with unsanitized hands getting them on and off before using them again?
I am still seeing only about 3 out of 10 wearing them out in public. Some have them around their necks because they itch. Some are wearing gloves with their mask and then throwing them in the parking lots so others have to pick them up.
Masks seem like more of a placebo to make people feel like they are making a difference- with most people not using them properly while also cross-contaminating them, causing more risk to their health.
Just like the partial closing of the economy- if everything is not done by 100% of the population- it drastically reduces the effectiveness of the measures.
I see about the same percentage of people wearing them. It seems to be a higher percentage of people wearing them at Whole Foods, but everywhere else is less than half. I see many people with masks on, including the instacart shoppers, grabbing 5 or 6 apples, oranges, etc. before deciding on which one they want so it really just seems like the mask thing is just defeating the purpose. [Reply]
Originally Posted by Monticore:
There is also a difference between Dr Fauci and my wife when it comes to an opinion on this subject as well, I think my wife is a smart Doctor but I wouldn't take her word over an Epidemiologist/Respirologist on this subject .
Your wife probably has 100x more real world experience than Fauci. I also think its interesting the economist views are ignored while doctors who continually repeat "we don't know yet" are taken as gospel. [Reply]
Originally Posted by Halfcan:
So you are telling me all the people out in public wearing masks have not touched them with unsanitized hands getting them on and off before using them again?
I am still seeing only about 3 out of 10 wearing them out in public. Some have them around their necks because they itch. Some are wearing gloves with their mask and then throwing them in the parking lots so others have to pick them up.
Masks seem like more of a placebo to make people feel like they are making a difference- with most people not using them properly while also cross-contaminating them, causing more risk to their health.
Just like the partial closing of the economy- if everything is not done by 100% of the population- it drastically reduces the effectiveness of the measures.
This is why the mask thing is a waste of time.
The only 100% effective masks are the medical/N95 masks and the CDC has emphasized they don't want the general public to wear those type of masks. [Reply]
