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Nzoner's Game Room>*** The Definitive Gannon vs. Grbac DEBUNKED Thread ***
htismaqe 01:07 PM 01-02-2014
It's time.

The common urban legend perpetuated amongst Chiefs fans is that we would have won that 1997 playoff game with Rich Gannon because he was clearly so much better than Grbac when in reality, that wasn't at all the case.

Let's start with wins and losses.

Code:
	Wins	Losses	Win %
Grbac	8	2	0.800
Gannon	5	1	0.833
Very similar. Let's look at a sample of passing stats now.

Code:
	Pass TD/Game	INT/Game	Passing YPG	YPA	Rating			
Grbac	1.1		0.6		195		6.2	79.1
Gannon	1.16		0.67		127		6.5	79.8
Again, this cross section points to them being remarkably similar. They ran fewer pass plays with Gannon at the helm so therefore appeared to be slightly more efficient but overall, the offensive output was very similar, regardless of who was under center.

Now, let's look at a couple of key defensive stats, since I think we all agree that the 1997 team was driven largely by the defense. This is where things get interesting.

Code:
	Def YPG	Def TO/Game
Grbac	335.4	1.9
Gannon	254.3	2.5
It's pretty clear what drove the Chiefs winning streak down the stretch - the defense got A LOT better as the season went on. In fact, the defense allowed LESS THAN 300 yards in only 2 of Grbac's starts, whereas that same defense allowed only one team to gain more than 300 yards while Gannon was under center.
[Reply]
Lex Luthor 11:04 PM 01-02-2014
Originally Posted by cdcox:
And to wet his pants and collapse under pressure in that game, just the things you were criticizing Grbac for.
Dude, Gruden was the coach of the other team. They KNEW the Raiders' offense.
[Reply]
Lex Luthor 11:05 PM 01-02-2014
Originally Posted by ChiefsCountry:
There was no ****ing difference between Grbac and Gannon in 1997. This mythical bullshit that Gannon was some amazing player was not true. Wasn't in 1997 or even today. I watched all of those games. We won a game on a long ass Stoyo kick which barely went in, throttled the 49ers and beat some really shitty teams ie Raiders and Chargers.
If you think there was no fucking difference between Grbac and Gannon in 1997, then you are blind.
[Reply]
ChiefsCountry 11:06 PM 01-02-2014
Originally Posted by Brainiac:
If you think there was no ****ing difference between Grbac and Gannon in 1997, then you are blind.
There wasn't any difference you douche. Chiefs played the same all fucking year.
[Reply]
cdcox 11:07 PM 01-02-2014
Originally Posted by Wallcrawler:
I think the reason for me being so angry about Gannon not getting the start in that Colts game was that when Grbac finally did get benched, Gannon nearly pulled the game out for us. He just ran out of time. That incomplete pass intended for Lake Dawson in the end zone has starred in many a nightmare for me.

Gannon was on a hot streak since Grbac's injury and the team was rolling and had good chemistry. Gannon should have gotten the start in my opinion. Again, based on what I saw from him at the end of the game, I really feel like had he played the entire game we win.
What the hell are you talking about?

The game was against Denver, not Indy.

Grbac played the whole game.

In the two years that Grbac and Gannon were both on the team, we never played Indy.

??????
[Reply]
Lex Luthor 11:08 PM 01-02-2014
Originally Posted by milkman:
After losing SB III to the Jets with Earl Morrell starting in place of an injured Johnny U, Don Shula decided at that point that he would start his number 1 QB in future playoffs if healthy, regardless of how well his back ups performed.

I think most HCs took their que from that.
When Johhny Unitas is the starter, you always put him back in if he's healthy. Elvis Grbac was not Johnny Unitas.

You are far too smart to try compare Elvis Grbac to Johnny Unitas, so I can only assume you are just saying that head coaches take theire cues from that, not that you agree with the philosophy.
[Reply]
Lex Luthor 11:09 PM 01-02-2014
Originally Posted by cdcox:
What the hell are you talking about?

The game was against Denver, not Indy.

Grbac played the whole game.

In the two years that Grbac and Gannon were both on the team, we never played Indy.

??????
He's referring to the 1995 playoff game against the Colts. Bono started the game and Gannon finished it. When Gannon went into the game it was like flipping a switch: suddenly the Chiefs were able to move the ball. Unfortunately, it was too late.
[Reply]
Chiefspants 11:10 PM 01-02-2014
Originally Posted by Wallcrawler:
That's hilarious, but not for the reason you think. Under Gruden, Gannon was slinging the football extremely well over a few seasons. He was actually the NFL MVP the year the fade went to the Superbowl. Raiders were a bigtime offense. Gannon "aired it out" a lot and got himself MVP honors doing it.

Jon Gruden is the reason Gannon had a horrible day in the superbowl. All you need to see is the clip of Jon Lynch ranting and raving about how "Every single thing he said they would do in practice, they are doing."

Bucs knew what was coming, because it was Gruden's offense not Bill Callahan's. Pretty easy to pick 5 and take 3 to the house when you have an amazing defense to begin with, but when you get told what's coming....forget it dude.

I think the reason for me being so angry about Gannon not getting the start in that Colts game was that when Grbac finally did get benched, Gannon nearly pulled the game out for us. He just ran out of time. That incomplete pass intended for Lake Dawson in the end zone has starred in many a nightmare for me.

Gannon was on a hot streak since Grbac's injury and the team was rolling and had good chemistry. Gannon should have gotten the start in my opinion. Again, based on what I saw from him at the end of the game, I really feel like had he played the entire game we win.
Yeah, Gannon oversaw a dink and dunk, run-first offense in Oakland. A large group of players from Oakland's team have blamed the 2002 loss on Callahan for choosing to air it out rather than sticking with the running game.
[Reply]
Chiefspants 11:11 PM 01-02-2014
Originally Posted by Brainiac:
He's referring to the 1995 game against the Colts. Grbac started the game and Gannon finished it. When Gannon went into the game it was like flipping a switch: suddenly the Chiefs were able to move the ball. Unfortunately, it was too late.
Correct me if I am incorrect, but Bono started that game.. right?
[Reply]
beach tribe 11:11 PM 01-02-2014
Originally Posted by cdcox:
And to wet his pants and collapse under pressure in that game, just the things you were criticizing Grbac for.
Dude, had the tuck rule not become famous and had Gannon not faced the guy who Callahan rode to even having a HC spot he may have 2 SB trophys.

BTW Gannon got to the SB to begin with. Grbac never did a god damn thing.

People who even argue that Grbac gave us as good a chance to win have ZERO recollection of watching the two play and if they do remember should not be posting.

Gannon was a gamer in KC. And then gamed the Raiders to the SB where, not surprisingly callahan got SCHOOLED by Gruden and one of the best Ds to ever play the game.
[Reply]
ChiefsCountry 11:11 PM 01-02-2014
Originally Posted by Brainiac:
He's referring to the 1995 game against the Colts. Grbac started the game and Gannon finished it. When Gannon went into the game it was like flipping a switch: suddenly the Chiefs were able to move the ball. Unfortunately, it was too late.
Grbac was on the team in 1995? You have lost all creditability in this debate now.
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beach tribe 11:11 PM 01-02-2014
Originally Posted by Chiefspants:
Correct me if I am incorrect, but Bono started that game.. right?
He meant 97"
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Chiefspants 11:13 PM 01-02-2014
Originally Posted by beach tribe:
He meant 97"
Gannon didn't finish the 97' playoff game.
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beach tribe 11:13 PM 01-02-2014
Originally Posted by ChiefsCountry:
Grbac was on the team in 1995. You have lost all creditability in this debate now.
LMFAO

Grbac was not on the team in 95.

You have lost all CREDITABILITY?? (Really?)
[Reply]
Lex Luthor 11:15 PM 01-02-2014
Originally Posted by Chiefspants:
Correct me if I am incorrect, but Bono started that game.. right?
Originally Posted by ChiefsCountry:
Grbac was on the team in 1995. You have lost all creditability in this debate now.
Yes, Bono started the game. Excuse me for the typo. I guess would have lost all "creditability" if such a word existed.

By the way, here's the box score: http://www.pro-football-reference.co...9601070kan.htm. Look closely at who finished the game at quarterback for the Chiefs.
[Reply]
beach tribe 11:17 PM 01-02-2014
Originally Posted by beach tribe:
He meant 97"
Whoops.
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