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The Lounge>*** The Definitive Gannon vs. Grbac DEBUNKED Thread ***
htismaqe 01:07 PM 01-02-2014
It's time.

The common urban legend perpetuated amongst Chiefs fans is that we would have won that 1997 playoff game with Rich Gannon because he was clearly so much better than Grbac when in reality, that wasn't at all the case.

Let's start with wins and losses.

Code:
	Wins	Losses	Win %
Grbac	8	2	0.800
Gannon	5	1	0.833
Very similar. Let's look at a sample of passing stats now.

Code:
	Pass TD/Game	INT/Game	Passing YPG	YPA	Rating			
Grbac	1.1		0.6		195		6.2	79.1
Gannon	1.16		0.67		127		6.5	79.8
Again, this cross section points to them being remarkably similar. They ran fewer pass plays with Gannon at the helm so therefore appeared to be slightly more efficient but overall, the offensive output was very similar, regardless of who was under center.

Now, let's look at a couple of key defensive stats, since I think we all agree that the 1997 team was driven largely by the defense. This is where things get interesting.

Code:
	Def YPG	Def TO/Game
Grbac	335.4	1.9
Gannon	254.3	2.5
It's pretty clear what drove the Chiefs winning streak down the stretch - the defense got A LOT better as the season went on. In fact, the defense allowed LESS THAN 300 yards in only 2 of Grbac's starts, whereas that same defense allowed only one team to gain more than 300 yards while Gannon was under center.
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milkman 05:14 PM 01-02-2014
After losing SB III to the Jets with Earl Morrell starting in place of an injured Johnny U, Don Shula decided at that point that he would start his number 1 QB in future playoffs if healthy, regardless of how well his back ups performed.

I think most HCs took their que from that.
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listopencil 05:55 PM 01-02-2014
I remember Grbac standing there on 4th and short at the end of the game waiting for a play call to come in from the sidelines. The process took forever. By the time they snapped the ball there was nothing to do but try to bomb one into the end zone. I've always felt that Gannon would have called a run by Marcus Allen, Allen would have gotten the first, then Gannon would have spiked the ball to stop the clock. That doesn't mean that KC would have won, but I think Gannon's personality and confidence would have kept KC alive at that point. We had also been eaten alive the previous year by Mark Brunell who (I think) had a similar skillset to Gannon. Brunell would throw on the run, run the ball and just stay very mobile in general to keep his O going.
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rabblerouser 06:02 PM 01-02-2014
i don't give a shit.

it was supposed to be Gannon over Bono in '95, anyway - debunk THAT one.
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Bump 06:27 PM 01-02-2014
also, if there was instant replay back then we would have won.
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Halfcan 06:31 PM 01-02-2014
Gannon could run, had a lot of heart and leadership. Gbac was great at throwing 300 mile fastballs at wide open recievers feet then blaming them for the miss.
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Dave Lane 06:33 PM 01-02-2014
Originally Posted by Pam Oliver's Forehead:
What about points per game?
What about when an opponent scored 24 or more points?
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cdcox 06:56 PM 01-02-2014
Originally Posted by FringeNC:
Gannon went on to have a much better end of career than Grbac.
With a coach that the Chiefs didn't have, in a system unique to that coach, with 2 HOFer WRs.

Gannon wasn't ever going to amount to anything as a Chief.
[Reply]
Three7s 06:59 PM 01-02-2014
Originally Posted by listopencil:
I remember Grbac standing there on 4th and short at the end of the game waiting for a play call to come in from the sidelines. The process took forever. By the time they snapped the ball there was nothing to do but try to bomb one into the end zone. I've always felt that Gannon would have called a run by Marcus Allen, Allen would have gotten the first, then Gannon would have spiked the ball to stop the clock. That doesn't mean that KC would have won, but I think Gannon's personality and confidence would have kept KC alive at that point. We had also been eaten alive the previous year by Mark Brunell who (I think) had a similar skillset to Gannon. Brunell would throw on the run, run the ball and just stay very mobile in general to keep his O going.
I'm still blaming that sequence on Marty. It's a coach's job to know what to do on 4th and 1 with 30 sec left. He chose the wrong option.
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Psyko Tek 07:00 PM 01-02-2014
Originally Posted by KCFaninSEA:
Grbac hadn't played in weeks and the team seemed to be hitting their stride at the right time. Grbac gets healthy and a huge change was made. I still contend that if Gannon played that game we go on to win the whole thing.
I knew Marty fucked up when he made the change Gannon was hot and the team was with him
I will always believe it was the wrong choice
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Reerun_KC 07:03 PM 01-02-2014
No myth to debunk. If Marty was involved it always ends on failure.
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cdcox 07:07 PM 01-02-2014
Since when is 127 ypg passing a hot hand? Geez. Chiefs fans. :-)
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cdcox 07:09 PM 01-02-2014
Plus Denver Broncos*.

(* Violated the salary cap during their championship seasons)
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ChiefsCountry 07:20 PM 01-02-2014
Offense points per game.
Grbac - 19
Gannon - 21

Also remember that the last game that Gannon started he was horrible 8/25 for 116 yards. The 49er ass whooping game is the one everybody seems to remember.
[Reply]
Anyong Bluth 07:35 PM 01-02-2014
Originally Posted by milkman:
While I am still skeptical that Smith will be anything more than a mediocre game manager, I disagree with the idea that he and Gannon are the same type of QB.

They are/were both mobile, but Smith has a far stronger arm, much stronger than given credit for.

In theory, Smith could be more dynamic.
My hope and what I think is key are 2 things-

An actual qb coach in Reid

- and -

Building up Alex's confidence- with a coach / organization that actually has confidence in him.

Andy clearly has seen something he loves in Smith, and in turn can actually teach and groom a top level NFL quarterback.
He's gone a majority of his time in San Francisco with piss poor coaching. When Harbaugh arrived you saw improvement, but it's fairly obvious Alex was never ''his'' guy, and I think that played a part in limiting what was asked of him there, and coach found his 1st opportunity he could jump at to start CK full time & never gave it a 2nd thought.

What we saw for a long while to start the season was a lot more of the safe - never take chances play and everybody figured that was all he could do. I think he will be more aggressive as he gets better adjusted to a new team, players and offense. Partly because Andy wanted to ease him in to build his confidence and get used to the new offense. We've seen at times he's been doing more deeper passing as well as aggressive play calls.

I think it was a smart move in building a solid foundation for early success at the cost of learning to walk before you run.

I won't be at all surprised to see it expand and shock a few people with his play in season 2 in KC.
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listopencil 08:18 PM 01-02-2014
Originally Posted by Three7s:
I'm still blaming that sequence on Marty. It's a coach's job to know what to do on 4th and 1 with 30 sec left. He chose the wrong option.
Yeah, I agree. I think blowing so much time calling a play killed the O. That's on the coaches, that's on Marty. In retrospect with perfect 20/20 hindsight you give it to perhaps the best short yardage back in NFL history and you let him make the play.
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