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Washington DC and The Holy Land>What is the conservative position on student loans?
NJChiefsFan27 08:59 AM 05-24-2019
Specifically two things.

1. Is there a problem with the way things are done currently?

2. If you believe the status quo is not working, what should be done from a policy perspective to address it?
[Reply]
ghak99 10:14 AM 05-24-2019
Originally Posted by NJChiefsFan27:
In what way would banks financing these loans change the underlying problem of students taking on enormous debt to pay for an education that may or may not even lead to a successful career in their field of choice?
A bank would say no.

Currently it should be,
You want to major in something with little to no chance of a return? No.
You want to change your major? Not until approved.
You want to learn a trade? Sign right here.
Nursing school? Sign right here.

It's simple supply and demand economics, or it should be. Cut off the ignorant amount of "free" funding and colleges would admit a lot of their products are based on blue sky and bullshit. As it is now they have free reign to pump and dump kids at the rates they are because they're sucking on the government guaranteed tit. Loans shouldn't be handed out as if they are participation ribbons.
[Reply]
Hammock Parties 10:15 AM 05-24-2019
Originally Posted by Eleazar:
I don't have any problem with the government subsiding loans in situations like this, where it's an investment that will actually pay dividends to the economy.
Yes just giving stupid people more money will automatically make them make better decisions.
[Reply]
ChiTown 10:16 AM 05-24-2019
Originally Posted by Taco John:
The solution is very simple: make schools co-signers in any student loans and responsible for defaults. The problem with secondary education today is that schools have been let off the accountability hook.
Truth.

Schools don't care how much debt you incur, or how you do it. They just sit back and cash the checks as the students keep spinning through the turnstiles.

Moreover, not everyone should be going to college. I'm not talking about the economically disadvantaged. I'm referring to those that aren't intellectually capable of advancing, but still spend $80K+ getting that sheep skin. The reality is that they should have been learning a trade skill right out of HS vs incurring debt needlessly that will never pay off. As the saying goes, the world needs ditch diggers too...
[Reply]
Hammock Parties 10:18 AM 05-24-2019
Originally Posted by dirk digler:
As a country\society we need more people going into STEM jobs or becoming doctors but it also shouldn't cost 6 figures to go to school to get that degree.
Bullshit. It should cost whatever people will pay.
[Reply]
dirk digler 10:19 AM 05-24-2019
Originally Posted by Eleazar:
You don't think the ROI of a degree in medicine is high enough when a person will make that amount of money back in one year of their 40-ish years of work?

You would hope so. I couldn't imagine being a student and seeing I owed 200k right out of college.
[Reply]
Hammock Parties 10:20 AM 05-24-2019
Originally Posted by NJChiefsFan27:
Comparing buying a new car to getting an education is absolutely insane.
No it's not.

It's just being an idiot on a smaller scale.

Only reason you don't hear about bailouts for stupid ass auto loans is because it's not life-wrecking.

You wreck your life, you fix it.

Maybe the government should also pay for health care for all these people who fuck up their lives with drugs....oh wait everyone wants that, too.

Good thing we got Trump because none of you are getting any of this free shit.

So you can stop bringing this bullshit up.
[Reply]
Eleazar 10:22 AM 05-24-2019
Originally Posted by dirk digler:
You would hope so. I couldn't imagine being a student and seeing I owed 200k right out of college.
Sure, you start out on a smaller salary as a resident, but you'll be making that much a year eventually and the repayment period on the loan might be 10 or 20 years.
[Reply]
Prison Bitch 10:24 AM 05-24-2019
Originally Posted by Hammock Parties:
The Pentagon does things that baristas can't.

When you have a certain value to society....hear me out here...preserving that value with government funding is a good thing for everyone.
What “certain value” does Iraq, Israel and Puerto Rico have?


Hear me out here.
[Reply]
chiefzilla1501 10:25 AM 05-24-2019
Originally Posted by Eleazar:
You don't think the ROI of a degree in medicine is high enough when a person will make that amount of money back in one year of their 40-ish years of work?
Is that the case? Between student loans, high expenses, and the long residency slug, it takes such a long time to even start making money. I had a few people I know drop out of med training school purely because of finances. The people who survive this training tend to be rich.
[Reply]
dirk digler 10:25 AM 05-24-2019
Originally Posted by Hammock Parties:

Maybe the government should also pay for health care for all these people who fuck up their lives with drugs....oh wait everyone wants that, too.

Good thing we got Trump because none of you are getting any of this free shit.

So you can stop bringing this bullshit up.

We do already it is called Medicaid.
[Reply]
NJChiefsFan27 10:26 AM 05-24-2019
Originally Posted by Bwana:
Bingo
This is just such a stupid argument it's amazing that anybody can find it persuasive.

Imagine for a second that the government started dropping off dead animals painted bright orange in the middle of the street. Traffic accidents then began to rise considerably, but responsible drivers like you and me were mostly unaffected because we were paying attention. My response would be that the government should stop putting the general population at risk by putting hazards on the road, yours would be that people should learn to pay attention and drive better. It's asinine.
[Reply]
chiefzilla1501 10:28 AM 05-24-2019
Originally Posted by Hammock Parties:
Yes just giving stupid people more money will automatically make them make better decisions.
A lot of these people aren't stupid. They can often be trained in a specific trade or vocation if you put it in front of them. Just because they couldn't pass the sciences doesn't mean they can't be brilliant somewhere else.

And if giving people the tools to create a life for themselves keeps them off the street where they can commit property crimes, use welfare and rehab, go to expensive jail, etc... A little investment in them to prevent future cost is well worth it.
[Reply]
NJChiefsFan27 10:29 AM 05-24-2019
Originally Posted by ghak99:
A bank would say no.

Currently it should be,
You want to major in something with little to no chance of a return? No.
You want to change your major? Not until approved.
You want to learn a trade? Sign right here.
Nursing school? Sign right here.

It's simple supply and demand economics, or it should be. Cut off the ignorant amount of "free" funding and colleges would admit a lot of their products are based on blue sky and bullshit. As it is now they have free reign to pump and dump kids at the rates they are because they're sucking on the government guaranteed tit. Loans shouldn't be handed out as if they are participation ribbons.
He was talking about guaranteeing private student loans, which is very different than what you're proposing.
[Reply]
lawrenceRaider 10:32 AM 05-24-2019
Originally Posted by Hammock Parties:
you signed the piece of paper, your problem

learn some personal fucking responsibility
This to some degree.

However the loans themselves seem a bit predatory along with the institutions giving people useless degrees. Do 18 year old kids really understand what they are signing up for with these huge loans?
[Reply]
chiefzilla1501 10:33 AM 05-24-2019
Originally Posted by NJChiefsFan27:
Free education is a misnomer. Nothing is free. It would come out of your taxes. But at the point where you're applying for higher education, it wouldn't cost you anything extra. But it's still not free.
Agreed. But here's what I think is intriguing about the right kind of "free" or at least affordable education option. If you train a kid in cyber or water infrastructure... Taxpayers may subsidize some of their education, but they also receive the benefit of better public tech and water. I just think with the automation boom that's coming, we need to start getting people trained to understand infrastructure and we need to do it immediately.
[Reply]
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