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Washington DC and The Holy Land>What is the conservative position on student loans?
NJChiefsFan27 08:59 AM 05-24-2019
Specifically two things.

1. Is there a problem with the way things are done currently?

2. If you believe the status quo is not working, what should be done from a policy perspective to address it?
[Reply]
NJChiefsFan27 12:12 PM 05-24-2019
Originally Posted by Over Yonder:
This is another thing. My son is in the process of paying his student loans off right now. They set his payment schedule up at some ridiculous payment. Can't remember now, but lets say $150/month for a bazillion years. Thankfully, my son has a conservative father that just about had a stroke when I seen that :-) Had the little talk with him about getting raped with interest. So he was/is smart enough to make much more than the minimum payment.

I can't help thinking about all the youth out there that are not fortunate enough to have a fiscally minded adult to explain stuff like that to them. Kinda sad :-)
Paying off loans faster isn't always smart, actually. In fact, there are many examples of this being a bad idea. Real estate investing is one example of where this kind of thing happens regularly. Borrowing over longer terms with low interest rates is basically always hugely beneficial.
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Megatron96 12:14 PM 05-24-2019
Forgot something:

If possible and when appropriate, refinance student loan as early as possible for a better rate/payment schedule.

Everything I posted set aside for a moment, student loans can be a kind of a trap. I believe that schools, maybe even in high school, should be teaching kids how loans work, how to decide if a loan is necessary, basically the fundamentals of loans/loan-making. Too many kids think "look, free money!" and end up with all kinds of penalties, etc.

I was lucky. My father helped me understand what I was getting into before I got a loan.

But some parents aren't any more knowledgeable about loans than their kids. Someone should be teaching kids what a loan is before they ever get to the point of thinking they need one.

It's a shame, because I have too many friends whose kids are dealing with student loan debt now and have made a big enough mess of it that they're thinking about crazy solutions or ways to evade paying off the things, when they should've gotten an education about what they were getting into at the very beginning.
[Reply]
dirk digler 12:14 PM 05-24-2019
Originally Posted by Prison Bitch:
These are programs I am willing to pay for.


The GI Bill was a really good program. As are itís atecedents. I think Vets today get free tutiiin at in state Publics if they serve.

See us libs and conservatives can agree on things..



You might be surprised that buttplug supports a national service program too :-)
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Hammock Parties 12:17 PM 05-24-2019
Originally Posted by Over Yonder:
I follow ya Hammock. you know the old saying anybody who is not a liberal at 20 has no heart, anybody who is not a conservative at 30 has no brain.

I feel for the kids, not so much the adults. At some point a person does need to figure life out.... or drink a couple gallons of anti freeze, whichever a person so chooses :-)
30? shit...they need to move that up to at least 40....
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Hammock Parties 12:19 PM 05-24-2019
Originally Posted by NJChiefsFan27:
Paying off loans faster isn't always smart, actually.

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BigRichard 12:20 PM 05-24-2019
This is going to make me feel all icky inside but I think Taco said something to the effect that colleges should cosign the loans and that isn't to bad of an idea. Not necessarily cosign loans but something where they are as much responsible for the debt if there is a default as the student. I would guess things would turn around damn quickly if they did.
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HonestChieffan 12:20 PM 05-24-2019
Originally Posted by Hammock Parties:

boy aint that so
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NJChiefsFan27 12:34 PM 05-24-2019
Originally Posted by Hammock Parties:
So you wouldn't consider borrowing money at 2.5% interest to invest in something that nets you a 10% ROI?
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Hammock Parties 12:43 PM 05-24-2019
Originally Posted by NJChiefsFan27:
So you wouldn't consider borrowing money at 2.5% interest to invest in something that nets you a 10% ROI?
Can you start a thread on climate change or perhaps the new green deal so we can make fun of you more?

That's all those "policies" are good for.
[Reply]
NJChiefsFan27 12:49 PM 05-24-2019
Originally Posted by Hammock Parties:
Can you start a thread on climate change or perhaps the new green deal so we can make fun of you more?

That's all those "policies" are good for.
I think we should draw more attention to the fact that you have zero understanding of financial investing and are attempting to change the subject after you have been exposed as an ignoramus.
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chiefzilla1501 12:53 PM 05-24-2019
Originally Posted by Over Yonder:
My position is, they served their country. They did a job/service for me and you that we were to lazy, scared, unmotivated, etc. ect. to do. They preformed this duty, we as a nation at this point owe them. In my book, they are taken care of for life. Loaning a student money blindly before they have ever done crap then automatically expecting a bailout when they fall flat on their face are two ENTIRELY different conversations.

But a point I have seen touched on here is parental pressure. That is a real thing. A buddy of my brother pushed and pressured his daughter to go to school to be a lawyer. She didn't want to, but they pushed and pressured and she did it. She eventually failed out, but she did win a nice student loan debt as a consolation prize. Bad parenting IMO. Too many people think their little Johnny and Suzie are the smartest people to walk the face of the Earth. Love 'em or not, some people just ain't college material.

That is not the government's fault :-)
I agree with the service aspect. But why not also extend that to trades. There's no shortage of infrastructure needs out there. What if for example we helped a student out with tuition to learn a trade in exchange for them using the trade for public service upon graduation. I don't love handing out free liberal arts education like candy. But why not rethink how we can use education to close our major skills gaps?
[Reply]
BryanBusby 12:58 PM 05-24-2019
Originally Posted by NJChiefsFan27:
I think we should draw more attention to the fact that you have zero understanding of financial investing and are attempting to change the subject after you have been exposed as an ignoramus.
It's pretty funny watching all those lovely takes.

The Government shouldn't be in the business of subsidizing a bunch of loans, but they really need to crack down on the companies acting like total dickheads when borrowers try to work out payment plans and work out a way to get back to the days where kids actually have the option to work on the side to actually pay for school without needing mega loans. It's hard to hold these kids to the highest of standards since most schools don't bother to teach personal finance (parents likely don't have a clue, either) and they are brainwashed into thinking it's impossible to live without a Bachelors degree.

Offer some real affordable paths to a Bachelor's, make Financing 101 mandatory and make the kids go to seminars to let them know there are other options besides traditional college.
[Reply]
Shields68 01:08 PM 05-24-2019
Originally Posted by NJChiefsFan27:
How is that different than teenagers who were told that getting a degree would lead to getting a good job? We have also seen decades of our government not properly taking care of veterans, so couldn't you argue they should have known better? Again, if we're taking the personal responsibility approach.
Really not sure what position you are arguing. Are you against those getting a good job paying their debt, or just the dropouts? I think the vast majority make a lot more money if they get a college degree (Which again on average make $20,000 a year more, which exceeds the payments on the debt), and I see no reason they should receive a financially benefit for going to college and not be responsible for the cost.

The government and society is not promising every college grad a job. But it does not take a rocket scientist to know what fields are in demand and that if you dropout or flunk out you probably are not going to get a benefit.

As for Veterans not really sure what your argument is, they are responsible for their decisions yes. They can not complain about missing out on college or going to Iraq. But part of the program they signed up for if they get hurt, which is not their fault they did not choose to get hurt, the government will help them.

Originally Posted by :

The issue is that tuition costs are skyrocketing, wages are stagnant, and getting a job in your field can be very difficult.

Even if we say that these people are "responsible", there's still the question of whether it's economically healthy for so much of the population to be trapped in debt. That is money which could have went to stimulating the economy rather than paying off a government loan.
As far as tuition costs, think it has been pointed out numerous times that the problem is the government loans themselves. That has been a primary driver of increased costs.

The loan payments are going back into the economy. I mean if the governments wants a stimulus package there are far more deserving groups then the college grads.
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Taco John 01:15 PM 05-24-2019
Originally Posted by NJChiefsFan27:
Paying off loans faster isn't always smart, actually.
It's hard for me to fathom how many people have bought into this lie...
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Taco John 01:18 PM 05-24-2019
Originally Posted by BigRichard:
This is going to make me feel all icky inside but I think Taco said something to the effect that colleges should cosign the loans and that isn't to bad of an idea. Not necessarily cosign loans but something where they are as much responsible for the debt if there is a default as the student. I would guess things would turn around damn quickly if they did.
If colleges were on the hook for defaults, they'd think twice about admissions standards and worthwhile curriculum.
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