I know the immediate reaction will be "No, it was Mahomes all they way", but a few post draft interviews leave me wondering if Trubisky was the #1 QB on their board. First, in the MMQB 49ers draft article Shanahan was quoted as saying KC was offering a lot to the Titans to move up to #5. The 49ers couldn't fathom who KC was trading up for.
The Titans GM was on Sirius radio doing a post draft interview and he talked about how a couple of teams had reached out to them to trade up to #5, but that all the calls went dead after the Bears chose Trubisky at #2 and came off the board.
So, is there a chance KC wanted to move to #5 for Mitch? [Reply]
Originally Posted by O.city:
If Mahomes isn't ready to go by the start of next season, somethings gone wrong imo, in that it's essentially signaling that he's not where they expect him to be based on the alignment of Smith's contract.
There could be many reasons why the Chiefs head into 2018 with Smith as the starter. Hell, the same thing happened with Kaepernick. Smith led the 49ers to a 6-2 record, had a concussion and Kaepernick led them to the Super Bowl.
I could envision the same thing happening in KC (minus the Super Bowl, because Chiefs) if Mahomes isn't ready Week 1.
Keep in mind, while Mahomes will run the scout team in 2017, he'll spend very little time, if any, with the #1 offense. Andy Reid has already said that he won't be splitting time with Smith & Mahomes with the 1's.
Originally Posted by O.city:
If they want to keep smith in that situation, they'd need to restructure imo.
I just don't see it that way. The salary cap will be even higher in 2018 and there's no reason to just outright cut Alex Smith, especially before the season starts.
What if a similar situation that happened in Minnesota last year arises in 2018 and the Chiefs can turn Smith into a Day One pick?
I think vitriolic hatred of Smith in this forum is blinding people to that fact that Mahomes may not be ready and that Smith isn't as worthless as the majority believes.
Originally Posted by O.city:
From over the cap it looks like cutting smith nets them 17 mil, where are you getting the 13.4?
Originally Posted by DaneMcCloud:
There could be many reasons why the Chiefs head into 2018 with Smith as the starter. Hell, the same thing happened with Kaepernick. Smith led the 49ers to a 6-2 record, had a concussion and Kaepernick led them to the Super Bowl.
I could envision the same thing happening in KC (minus the Super Bowl, because Chiefs) if Mahomes isn't ready Week 1.
Keep in mind, while Mahomes will run the scout team in 2017, he'll spend very little time, if any, with the #1 offense. Andy Reid has already said that he won't be splitting time with Smith & Mahomes with the 1's.
I just don't see it that way. The salary cap will be even higher in 2018 and there's no reason to just outright cut Alex Smith, especially before the season starts.
What if a similar situation that happened in Minnesota last year arises in 2018 and the Chiefs can turn Smith into a Day One pick?
I think vitriolic hatred of Smith in this forum is blinding people to that fact that Mahomes may not be ready and that Smith isn't as worthless as the majority believes.
Eh, I looked at it wrong.
He's not worthless at all, I'm not for sure but what they won't try and trade him and get a pick.
But 17 mill is a shit ton of cap gain, especially for a team up against it and with alot of young players coming due soon. Seems like a waste to hold on to him just in the off chance something like that hapoens. [Reply]
If they're gonna go with Mahomes though, he needs to be put in the best situation he can be early, and that money would go along way in acquiring talent [Reply]
Originally Posted by DaneMcCloud:
I just don't see it that way. The salary cap will be even higher in 2018 and there's no reason to just outright cut Alex Smith, especially before the season starts.
What if a similar situation that happened in Minnesota last year arises in 2018 and the Chiefs can turn Smith into a Day One pick?
I think vitriolic hatred of Smith in this forum is blinding people to that fact that Mahomes may not be ready and that Smith isn't as worthless as the majority believes.
"No reason to just outright cut..."
Sure there is - if you believe Mahomes can give you average play at the position, you cut Smith. That's it. You don't pay for a $17 million backup quarterback. The opportunity cost is far too great.
And while I don't know how guaranteed salaries work, I know veterans get a kicker on the guarantees if they're on the roster as of a certain date. I think it's something like 6 weeks guaranteed if they're on the Roster on in mid-summer. I don't remember it exactly but if you don't cut Smith pre-season, you're paying a $2 million roster bonus and I'm betting a fairly substantial portion of his contract. Moreover, that's a monsterously dick move as he'd be unable to get a contract elsewhere if you cut him in July. You don't do that to a loyal veteran QB that's been nothing but a good soldier here.
If Mahomes shows any indications that he's ready, you do the right thing for both sides and you move on from Smith before the start of the 2018 league year in March. If that means trade him for a nominal asset - great. If it means cut him, that's fine, too. [Reply]
Originally Posted by O.city:
If they're gonna go with Mahomes though, he needs to be put in the best situation he can be early, and that money would go along way in acquiring talent
The thing is though, that's not how Dorsey works (and when he's done that, it's worked against him).
The Dwayne Bowe extension was awful. Dorsey didn't need to give Maclin $13 million a year, IMO, and that bit them in the ass last year and will likely do so again this year. He's on the downside, for sure.
Joe Mays, Donnie Avery, Anthony Fasano, Vance Walker, Jeff Linkenbach, Dunta Robinson - that's just a partial list. While they've certainly done well developing waiver wire acquisitions, the record in free agency has been poor.
I hold out hope that Bennie Logan returns to his 2015 form because $8 million is quite a bit for one year. [Reply]
Originally Posted by O.city:
He's not worthless at all, I'm not for sure but what they won't try and trade him and get a pick.
But 17 mill is a shit ton of cap gain, especially for a team up against it and with alot of young players coming due soon. Seems like a waste to hold on to him just in the off chance something like that hapoens.
Look at it this way - keeping Smith costs you $3 million in AAV on Peters inevitable 5-6 year deal. That $17.5 million in rollover means you've effectively turned the $16 million/yr deal you'd have to give Peters and turned it into a $13 million/yr deal.
Unless Mahomes just keeps stepping on his dick, you can't keep Smith. I'm serious - if Mahomes shows ANYTHING, you have to move on. It hurts the roster too much elsewhere to do otherwise. [Reply]
Originally Posted by DJ's left nut:
"No reason to just outright cut..."
Sure there is - if you believe Mahomes can give you average play at the position, you cut Smith. That's it. You don't pay for a $17 million backup quarterback. The opportunity cost is far too great.
Even IF there's that possibility, they'd be better off keeping Smith until just before Week 1 at his current salary, just in case there's a possible trade.
As for my understanding, Smith's $14.6 million dollar salary won't guaranteed until Week 1 of the season, so while they might take a gamble on his roster bonus and workout bonus ($2.5), they'd still eat his prorated $3.6, regardless of when he's cut.
Peter King mentioned this morning that in 2011, QB's when 8-10-12 (Jake Locker, Blaine Gabbert and Christian Ponder). Only Gabbert's still in the league and that's as a Vet Min backup with the Cards.
It's a long ways into the future and no one knows what the future holds. Expecting Mahomes to be ready Week 1 to take over and lead this team to double digit wins and the playoffs is setting up very high expectations, IMO, especially when the kid hasn't taken an NFL snap. [Reply]
Originally Posted by DaneMcCloud:
Even IF there's that possibility, they'd be better off keeping Smith until just before Week 1 at his current salary, just in case there's a possible trade.
As for my understanding, Smith's $14.6 million dollar salary won't guaranteed until Week 1 of the season, so while they might take a gamble on his roster bonus and workout bonus ($2.5), they'd still eat his prorated $3.6, regardless of when he's cut.
Peter King mentioned this morning that in 2011, QB's when 8-10-12 (Jake Locker, Blaine Gabbert and Christian Ponder). Only Gabbert's still in the league and that's as a Vet Min backup with the Cards.
It's a long ways into the future and no one knows what the future holds. Expecting Mahomes to be ready Week 1 to take over and lead this team to double digit wins and the playoffs is setting up very high expectations, IMO, especially when the kid hasn't taken an NFL snap.
After a season on the bench? I don't think that's too high of expectations. [Reply]
I was distancing myself from the eventual letdown that is chiefs football. :-)
Even with that, the front office traded quite a bit and took a big risk to go up and get him. If he's 2 years away from being ready to play, I question whether he was worth trading up that high for. [Reply]
Originally Posted by O.city:
I was distancing myself from the eventual letdown that is chiefs football. :-)
Even with that, the front office traded quite a bit and took a big risk to go up and get him. If he's 2 years away from being ready to play, I question whether he was worth trading up that high for.
As long as he becomes what they think he'll become, I don't care if he sits 24 or 32 games.
In terms of the compensation, I thought it was an absolute bargain. A third and a one? That's a pittance if he becomes a perennial Pro Bowl/All Pro QB. [Reply]
Originally Posted by DaneMcCloud:
As long as he becomes what they think he'll become, I don't care if he sits 24 or 32 games.
In terms of the compensation, I thought it was an absolute bargain. A third and a one? That's a pittance if he becomes a perennial Pro Bowl/All Pro QB.
If he is above average for what they payed its worth it.
People don't understand that draft capitol is more valuable than actual
cash. Some of these owners would spend 3x as much if they could.
It was a brilliant move to shoot for an all pro without mortgaging the
future. [Reply]
They thought Mahomes was going earlier than he did, which I believe they did comment on that. I don't think there was any interest, but it's based purely on speculation. [Reply]
Originally Posted by DRM08:
In the 49ers report, I assumed the Chiefs wanted Pat at #5 because of the Jets and Chargers. They got lucky neither of them went for a QB.
As far as the Titans GM goes, who knows what to think of that. They reached on Corey Davis and maybe he doesn't want to admit they turned down trade offers that were still on the table. Or maybe he's telling the truth and Reid/Dorsey are lying about Mahomes' performance relative to the other QB's in the interview process.
Trubisky is an interesting prospect. Some say he's a safer pick than Mahomes, but I think his bust potential is just as bad and possibly worse than Mahomes. Trubisky seems like a nice kid who is in over his head based on interviews I've seen, the Gruden show where he tried to bullshit his way through a hard count and Gruden nailed him for it, etc. I think his ceiling is game manager. I could also see him turning into a mega bust. Obviously Mahomes has mega bust potential too given the flaws in his game, but he also has superstar potential on the high end.
I think Tribisky going to Chicago will increase his odds of a short career. DaBear fans have already booed him in public and are still comatose from watching Cutler all those years. If you have ever been to a game at Soldier field- the fans are obnoxious, impatient and will start calling for his benching after the first interception. [Reply]
