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Nzoner's Game Room>***NON-POLITICAL COVID-19 Discussion Thread***
JakeF 10:28 PM 02-26-2020
A couple of reminders...

Originally Posted by Bwana:
Once again, don't come in this thread with some kind of political agenda, or you will be shown the door. If you want to go that route, there is a thread about this in DC.
Originally Posted by Dartgod:
People, there is a lot of good information in this thread, let's try to keep the petty bickering to a minimum.

We all have varying opinions about the impact of this, the numbers, etc. We will all never agree with each other. But we can all keep it civil.

Thanks!

Click here for the original OP:

Spoiler!

[Reply]
Hammock Parties 07:49 AM 03-30-2020
Wow.

#coronavirus News Alert: Dr. Vladimir Zelenko, a board-certified family practitioner in NY, has now treated 699 Covid-19 patients with 100% success using Hydroxychloroquine Sulfate, Zinc and Z-Pak. All symptoms of shortness of breath resolved within 4-6 hr https://t.co/siCvNg845Q pic.twitter.com/lOrUvBHp0A

— Adam Milstein (@AdamMilstein) March 29, 2020

[Reply]
Mecca 07:50 AM 03-30-2020
We're always going to have some issues like apparently Alabama is not going to disclose any numbers at all.
[Reply]
RedRaider56 07:55 AM 03-30-2020
Originally Posted by Hammock Parties:
Wow.

wait a minute....I thought this stuff wasn't suppose to work. :-)
[Reply]
RedRaider56 07:56 AM 03-30-2020
Originally Posted by Mecca:
We're always going to have some issues like apparently Alabama is not going to disclose any numbers at all.
They have a difficult time counting in Alabama
[Reply]
Hammock Parties 07:57 AM 03-30-2020

2. It is important to note that New York State is participating in the trial of 4 WHO recommended COVID-19 treatment regimens which include Chloroquine/hydroxychloroquine...

Maybe one or more of those regimens is working well.

This �� is the list the regimens pic.twitter.com/iYeZSwgGbO

— Kudzai Mutisi (@KMutisi) March 30, 2020

[Reply]
O.city 07:59 AM 03-30-2020
Originally Posted by AustinChief:
This is what I wanted from the get go. Unfortunately there is no 100% foolproof solution for that BUT I think we and local/state/Federal governments can continue to emphasize this point and do what we can individually and collectively to subsidize those that should be sequestered. That should be enough.

By caseload, I would agree with you IF we are talking those in critical condition and the US death rate. We can't use overall caseload as a metric since the vast majority of people are fine to get the virus and recover even without any treatment.

Regarding treatment, at what point do you consider a treatment effective? I am not prepared to wait 3-6 months for an entire workup on each trial. I think we are going to have to take a certain leap of faith at some point in the near future.
It takes time to know if it will work and if it’s safe. You don’t wanna mass roll out a treatment that doesn’t work or kills more people
[Reply]
Deberg_1990 08:00 AM 03-30-2020
Originally Posted by BigRedChief:
Who could have seen this coming?
:-)


Wow.

He should be criminally charged for that decision.
[Reply]
Mecca 08:00 AM 03-30-2020
I just saw that Turkey is getting destroyed they have over 500,000 cases.
[Reply]
'Hamas' Jenkins 08:05 AM 03-30-2020
Originally Posted by RedRaider56:
wait a minute....I thought this stuff wasn't suppose to work. :-)
Well, normally we make evidence-based medical decisions upon the results of randomized clinical trials and not tweets about the claims of success from a single practitioner.
[Reply]
Kidd Lex 08:08 AM 03-30-2020
Originally Posted by Hammock Parties:
Wow.

Unlike Dane I think this may be the way home. The NY clinical trials that just started will be the key, and the fact that the FDA approved the trials is a good sign. The problem with going all in is a lot the data comes from a French study that was flawed and poorly written, but as more real data comes out by the day we will know if this is the magic elixir we’ve all been looking for.
[Reply]
DJ's left nut 08:09 AM 03-30-2020
Originally Posted by Mecca:
I just saw that Turkey is getting destroyed they have over 500,000 cases.
What?

They haven't even tested 100K people yet, from any available data I can see.
[Reply]
Gravedigger 08:10 AM 03-30-2020
Originally Posted by Deberg_1990:
Wow.

He should be criminally charged for that decision.
He has money and influence, so he won't, but I agree he should. We charge people who knowingly cough on produce and lick deodorant sticks with terrorism so he shouldn't be any different, but he is.
[Reply]
penguinz 08:11 AM 03-30-2020
Originally Posted by Mecca:
I just saw that Turkey is getting destroyed they have over 500,000 cases.
Where? Not one tracker I have seen have them over 10k
[Reply]
Mecca 08:12 AM 03-30-2020
Originally Posted by DJ's left nut:
What?

They haven't even tested 100K people yet, from any available data I can see.
I saw it on reddit let me see if I can refind that...could easily be wrong.
[Reply]
'Hamas' Jenkins 08:14 AM 03-30-2020
Originally Posted by AustinChief:
I am going to again ask a question I asked a while back...

If by April 3rd(Friday) we have a solid trend of fewer deaths per day AND we have more significant data showing that the treatments we are applying are effective (let's say a 50% increased reduction of viral load compared to a control group or we can use cytokine storm reduction as the barometer), would you support starting to reduce government imposed restrictions?

If not, where do you draw the line? What metric would you use?

The way I see it, at some point WE need to make up our minds where the acceptable risk lies. There is NEVER going to be a world without risk. The flu kills 20-60k a year in the US and we don't bat an eye, we live with that risk every year. What is the acceptable risk for Covid-19?

Just to preempt anyone talking about number of cases... I will say right now I will never care about that figure it is fairly meaningless especially if effective treatments are an option. Deaths are really what matters to me when it comes to this discussion.
First, you'd need to be able to establish a reduction in viral load to an improvement in outcomes. There are tons of drugs that lead to improvements in clinical measurements but do not improve morbidity or mortality.

In heart failure with reduced ejection fraction there are three beta-blockers with evidence demonstrating a mortality benefit: metoprolol, carvedilol, and bisoprolol. Sure, other beta-blockers will reduce BP, but BP reduction is not itself always clinically significant, nor is the reduction in BP where the mortality benefit is derived from.

You guys really need to leave this to the professionals, because you're arguing about metrics that you don't understand and it is both harmful and incredibly arrogant.
[Reply]
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