This is the 2021 BBWAA Hall of Fame Ballot. 75% is required for induction into the National Baseball Hall of Fame. Please limit votes to a max 10 to be consistent with BBWAA voting rules. [Reply]
Originally Posted by 'Hamas' Jenkins:
It's 20 years old, so I'll give him some leeway, but given the extraordinarily small sample size, the attempt to parse how he hit in five games vs. three or what he accomplished in an individual AB given the leverage is ridiculous. No one is that good, especially in a sport as random as baseball.
I could make a patently absurd argument that Albert Pujols tried to throw the 2011 World Series. He wanted to put up huge numbers in Game 3 so that his overall performance looked solid, so he hit three homers with a double, and when the Cardinals were down in the 9th of Game 6, he doubled to further pretty up his stat line. But in the rest of the series, he had a grand total of two hits, and committed an egregious error that allowed the winning run to advance in the 9th inning of Game 2. Smells like the fix is in, right?
Or, maybe when players play well their team does well, and when they struggle the team struggles.
Did Pujols testify under oath that he accepted money and promised he would take part in throwing the World Series? Because if he did, then he won't make it to the HOF either.
There's no argument from me that it isn't a small sample size and that teams don't play better when an individual player plays better.
Neyer's basic point is correct, though, that the Costner defense of Shoeless Joe doesn't actually hold up that well under scrutiny. Costner and a bunch of lemmings think it is open and shut that Jackson played all out through the WS, but statistically, he did play poorly in the losses and admitted under oath that he took the money after agreeing to help throw the series. His performance in the losses certainly doesn't clear his name (small sample size or not)... [Reply]
Originally Posted by Pasta Giant Meatball:
They are legendary players, so fuck off. They belong in the hall.
They are legendary cheating shitbags that not only deserve to never make the HOF... they shouldn't be allowed anywhere near the game as coaches (mcgwire) or as owners (A-Roid). [Reply]
Originally Posted by cosmo20002:
OK, so sometime between those two pics. That doesn't really pinpoint it very much.
The book Game of Shadows chronicles a 1998 Christmas dinner where Barry Bonds told Ken Griffey Jr. and people close to him that he was peeved that all the talk during the past season was about the Mark McGwire and Sammy Sosa home run chase. Bonds thought he was a better player than both, and was upset that nobody was noticing him after a season in which he hit .303/.438/.609 with 37 home runs and 28 stolen bases.
Bonds suspected both McGwire and Sosa were using PEDs, and he would start doing the same to show baseball his greatness.
Here's an excerpt from his player bio from SABR:
In the winter following the 1998 season, Bonds began working with a trainer called Greg Anderson. Anderson was a low-level steroids user and dealer, hanging out in local gyms. Bonds began exercising with him, lifting weights and working out in an intense fashion. Anderson also introduced him to various steroids, which Bonds took on a regular basis. He showed up in spring training in 1999 having put on a lot of muscle weight. On first seeing him, teammate Charlie Hayes said to a reporter “Did you see my man? … He was huge!”12 But the rapid muscle gain came at a cost; in early 1999 Bonds suffered a torn triceps from stressing his elbow so much. He required surgery and eventually missed a third of the season.13 [Reply]
Originally Posted by jjchieffan:
Wow! A lot of votes for Bonds. I guess that cheating to break baseball's most hallowed record doesn't matter to those who voted for him.
Top 5 vote getters on this poll all went to roided up cheating sacks of shit.
Mind bottling. The only thing they deserve is the medical complications they are bound to have later in life. [Reply]
Originally Posted by jjchieffan:
Wow! A lot of votes for Bonds. I guess that cheating to break baseball's most hallowed record doesn't matter to those who voted for him.
This board has been tough on Bonds when you consider the writers currently have him at 68.8% on known ballots.
Originally Posted by TwistedChief:
Multiple PED suspensions?
I guess I had forgotten about that. I guess that's all that's keeping him out? If we're talking strictly based on his numbers, seems like he's an obvious choice. [Reply]
