This is the 2021 BBWAA Hall of Fame Ballot. 75% is required for induction into the National Baseball Hall of Fame. Please limit votes to a max 10 to be consistent with BBWAA voting rules. [Reply]
Originally Posted by R Clark:
Schilling deserves it
The only things Schilling deserves are the shrunken testicles he likely has and the loss of every cent he made while playing baseball he endured with his video game company. [Reply]
Originally Posted by R Clark:
Schilling deserves it
Schilling is a weird case.
If you look at only the numbers you can say that he gets in due to his WAR, because his counting stats are not great. However, he had a weird bump in productivity during the height of the steroid era when he should have been entering the decline years of his career, including 28.6 WAR (36% of his career total) from ages 35-38.
At the same time, one could potentially invoke the morality clause against Schilling, and given his hypocritical business practices and the past example of guys like Palmeiro, I can't say I'd be surprised if he was using despite his vocal protestations against PEDs, especially given how he defied the aging curve. [Reply]
Originally Posted by 'Hamas' Jenkins:
At the same time, one could potentially invoke the morality clause against Schilling, and given his hypocritical business practices and the past example of guys like Palmeiro, I can't say I'd be surprised if he was using despite his vocal protestations against PEDs, especially given how he defied the aging curve.
I think it's hard to invoke the morality clause unless a player has been convicted of a felony, or committed a harmful act against the sport (gambling).
Speaking of Schilling's business practices, Harmon Killebrew had some well-publicized business failures, too. I think that's human, they failed. I don't see it as a morality issue.
Schilling, for what it's worth, was the 2001 recipient of the Roberto Clemente Award.
If you want to make an argument that Schilling is guilty of 'hate speech'; I'll listen.
But I heard Jay Jaffe in a radio interview bring up Schilling tweeting about "Presidential election conspiracies" as if that has something to do with his character. I think that's a big-time reach.
I always hear about Schilling wearing a shirt about "lynching journalists" and I think it's blown out of proportion. Does anybody think he literally means that? The other thing I always hear is how incendiary Schilling's actions are. That he's going to influence some guy to cause physical harm to a journalist. That's reaching too thinking that people are swayed that easily to commit a crime.
I think Schilling had a HOF case on par with first-ballot HOF'r John Smoltz and he should have been in on the first ballot. [Reply]
Originally Posted by Ocotillo:
I think it's hard to invoke the morality clause unless a player has been convicted of a felony, or committed a harmful act against the sport (gambling).
Speaking of Schilling's business practices, Harmon Killebrew had some well-publicized business failures, too. I think that's human, they failed. I don't see it as a morality issue.
Schilling, for what it's worth, was the 2001 recipient of the Roberto Clemente Award.
If you want to make an argument that Schilling is guilty of 'hate speech'; I'll listen.
But I heard Jay Jaffe in a radio interview bring up Schilling tweeting about "Presidential election conspiracies" as if that has something to do with his character. I think that's a big-time reach.
I always hear about Schilling wearing a shirt about "lynching journalists" and I think it's blown out of proportion. Does anybody think he literally means that? The other thing I always hear is how incendiary Schilling's actions are. That he's going to influence some guy to cause physical harm to a journalist. That's reaching too thinking that people are swayed that easily to commit a crime.
I think Schilling had a HOF case on par with first-ballot HOF'r John Smoltz and he should have been in on the first ballot.
It's the weight of everything with Schilling. If you are looking at what he's said after leaving the game, probably the most damning thing is the fact that he had articles taken down by Breitbart of all places for cozying up to and parroting the POV of some pretty toxic white nationalists. [Reply]
Originally Posted by 'Hamas' Jenkins:
It's the weight of everything with Schilling. If you are looking at what he's said after leaving the game, probably the most damning thing is the fact that he had articles taken down by Breitbart of all places for cozying up to and parroting the POV of some pretty toxic white nationalists.
That's why I said if you had some evidence for hate speech, I'd listen. But all in all, he's a harmless idiot and regardless of what he says, I don't think he's literally hurting anyone.
The Athletic just documented Omar Vizquel for accusations of domestic violence. I think that's more morality clause worthy than what Schilling has said or written. Either way, I need a felony conviction to take it seriously, or an MLB suspension levied against a player. Otherwise, I'm just going to judge the player on his on-field achievements. [Reply]
Originally Posted by 'Hamas' Jenkins:
Statistical evidence points to Jackson not throwing that World Series, FWIW. He should be in. Rose, I don't have much sympathy given how long he lied to everyone.
Harold Baines has ruined the standard. There's some other questionable guys in there, but he's modern and recent and it's easy to say, "Well if Harold Baines is in..." [Reply]
Originally Posted by cosmo20002:
Harold Baines has ruined the standard. There's some other questionable guys in there, but he's modern and recent and it's easy to say, "Well if Harold Baines is in..."
Heh. They need to create a ‘Hall of very good’ [Reply]