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The Lounge>Busted ankle and Opioids
Holladay 02:26 PM 03-14-2019
My big dogs were playing with me while I was on a sheet of ice. Boom goes the dynamite!

Surgery, plates and screws. I have a bottle of Oxycodone 5 mg x 42 pills. 1 pill every 4 hrs.

The day after op, I was popping them like candy. Helped a bit. 3 days after, 1 per 3.5 hrs. 6 days post op I will take 2-3 for the whole day. Wakeup, Bedtime and a misc.

So the question is how does a person become addicted to these suckers?

I still have 5 more weeks in the cast, then 2-4 in a boot.

Tomorrow, I'll see if just ibuprofen 200 mg will do.

Do they use get high? Trips? Or is there pseudo pain that people use to feel better?
[Reply]
SupDock 02:59 PM 03-14-2019
Originally Posted by frozenchief:
My wife is a nurse and my father is a physician and my legal practice involves a fair amount of drug cases so I've researched this issue and discussed it with family members who have expertise. From what I've seen, addiction involves more than taking meds as prescribed. It seems to me that there are generally two kinds of addicts. FIrst are those who are just looking for something to get high. If they can't get heroin, they go for meth; if they can't get meth, they aim for cocaine. This type of addiction is more 'mental' than anything else because it is the feeling of being high that is important more than the particular substance. This is admittedly over-simplifying but I don't want to write a treatise. This doesn't seem to be your issue.

Second are those who develop physical addiction. These people start with some kind of injury and wind up needing meds to manage their pain. If your injury was relatively recent, this is way too early to say this is the case. This type of addiction takes months, if not longer. Managing your pain helps your recovery and it is better to stay in front, so to speak, of your pain than to try to take something to deal with pain after it flares up. This means that if you are to take meds every 4 hours and 4 hours comes and you're feeling fine, you should probably take your meds anyway to prevent the pain from coming back. This is really the case if your surgery was relatively recent, such as the past 5-8, maybe even 10, days. After that, you can start to stretch out the time between meds. And I wouldn't go to 200 grams of ibuprofen. I'd do 600 or so. My wife routinely just recommends 800 grams for headaches, muscle sprains, etc. It is exrtremely doubtful you would become physically addicted to the meds following this course. If you finish your pain meds and your ankle still hurts, you should talk with your doctor. My guess is that he won't be surprised if you need another course but he wants to make sure of it before he prescribes it.

Where I really see people get physically addicted are back injuries. I've represented several people who got involved in oxy distribution rings to feed their supply of oxys because of back injuries. Haven't seen anyone with a foot injury in that situation. And if you do have a situation where you are in constant pain, I'd recommend some type of marijuana. It works wonders, doesn't have the physical addiction or side effects (increasing dosages, constipation and thinking issues from what I've seen) that long-term narcotic use has.
Disagree. A physical addiction takes far less than months. The CDC recommends keeping acute scripts 3 days or less, many pharmacies won't fill new scripts with a duration greater than 7 days.
[Reply]
Naptown Chief 03:00 PM 03-14-2019
Originally Posted by chinaski:
When you are actually using them for pain or post surgery, the euphoric effect is mitigated. At least in my experience.
Agreed. I've been on two 10/325 hydrocodone 3xday in conjunction with 800mg gabapentin 3-4xday, 2 8mg hydromorphone on the really bad days because of (multiple) nagging injuries from one accident. Essentially, long story short, I was in an attic doing ductwork and stepped on a stud that wasn't nailed in properly. I'm 6'1 188 before the fat jokes start. Anyway, needless to say, I wasn't in the attic anymore when all was said and done. I fucked up my neck, back, hips, and SI joints. I have over a dozen injections, nerve blocks, have had hip surgery and had my pelvis fused to my spine on my left side. It's looking like my right side will be done too. I've been doing PT 2-3x week for nearly two years as well- The fall was 3/20/17

To answer your question, I don't take them to get high. Even being on the dosages I've been on for 1.5 years and have never once taken more than prescribed. That said, after about a month I'd start getting "dope sick" if I went any longer than about 18 hours without taking something. This is nasty shit and I cannot wait until the day that I can start tapering down and then eventually off.

While I personally don't like the sedation I feel on a fairly regular basis (I don't even drink mind you) I can absolutely see how this stuff can hook you. Just be careful whenever they throw this shit at you, which is done far too often by far too many doctors.
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displacedinMN 03:03 PM 03-14-2019
If you don't need them, don't. Then turn them in legally.

Hope you get better soon.
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Pablo 03:07 PM 03-14-2019
Crush three up and dome them. Then get back to us.

For science.
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Naptown Chief 03:07 PM 03-14-2019
Originally Posted by displacedinMN:
If you don't need them, don't. Then turn them in legally.

Hope you get better soon.
This. Take them to your primary. They'll be more than happy to discard them for you. I did this with every bottle of pills as I built up to my eventual dosage. I started on a substantially lower dose but it didn't touch the pain. Truth be told, I could probably take higher but I'd rather endure my current pain than continue higher up the narcotics ladder.
[Reply]
SupDock 03:12 PM 03-14-2019
Originally Posted by dwwataz:
This. Take them to your primary. They'll be more than happy to discard them for you. I did this with every bottle of pills as I built up to my eventual dosage. I started on a substantially lower dose but it didn't touch the pain. Truth be told, I could probably take higher but I'd rather endure my current pain than continue higher up the narcotics ladder.
Most offices cannot accept these meds. They need to go to a law enforcement office or pharmacy with a controlled substance drop box
[Reply]
TLO 03:12 PM 03-14-2019
Originally Posted by dwwataz:
Agreed. I've been on two 10/325 hydrocodone 3xday in conjunction with 800mg gabapentin 3-4xday, 2 8mg hydromorphone on the really bad days because of (multiple) nagging injuries from one accident. Essentially, long story short, I was in an attic doing ductwork and stepped on a stud that wasn't nailed in properly. I'm 6'1 188 before the fat jokes start. Anyway, needless to say, I wasn't in the attic anymore when all was said and done. I ****ed up my neck, back, hips, and SI joints. I have over a dozen injections, nerve blocks, have had hip surgery and had my pelvis fused to my spine on my left side. It's looking like my right side will be done too. I've been doing PT 2-3x week for nearly two years as well- The fall was 3/20/17

To answer your question, I don't take them to get high. Even being on the dosages I've been on for 1.5 years and have never once taken more than prescribed. That said, after about a month I'd start getting "dope sick" if I went any longer than about 18 hours without taking something. This is nasty shit and I cannot wait until the day that I can start tapering down and then eventually off.

While I personally don't like the sedation I feel on a fairly regular basis (I don't even drink mind you) I can absolutely see how this stuff can hook you. Just be careful whenever they throw this shit at you, which is done far too often by far too many doctors.
Goodness. This sounds like a horrible ordeal.
[Reply]
Naptown Chief 03:15 PM 03-14-2019
Originally Posted by SupDock:
Most offices cannot accept these meds. They need to go to a law enforcement office or pharmacy with a controlled substance drop box
Oh, I wasn't aware of that. My apologies for giving false information then. Perhaps I'd be better suited returning mine to pharmacy from now on, although my doctor has never said anything. My primary is also apart of the local (massive) hospital system though. There's a pharmacy a few floors down and they're directly connected to the hospital itself (skywalk across the road). Perhaps that's why?
[Reply]
Naptown Chief 03:16 PM 03-14-2019
Originally Posted by TLO:
Goodness. This sounds like a horrible ordeal.
Yeah, thanks brother. I omitted the part about worker's comp because that could easily be a novel in itself
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frozenchief 03:20 PM 03-14-2019
Originally Posted by SupDock:
Disagree. A physical addiction takes far less than months. The CDC recommends keeping acute scripts 3 days or less, many pharmacies won't fill new scripts with a duration greater than 7 days.
I disagree based upon my own research and observations. And the reason thatpharmacids won’t fill those scripts is because the DEA has prosecuted doctors for “over-prescribing medications”, even though DEA agents aren’t doctors. I’ve handled those cases as well.
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SupDock 03:21 PM 03-14-2019
Originally Posted by dwwataz:
Oh, I wasn't aware of that. My apologies for giving false information then. Perhaps I'd be better suited returning mine to pharmacy from now on, although my doctor has never said anything. My primary is also apart of the local (massive) hospital system though. There's a pharmacy a few floors down and they're directly connected to the hospital itself (skywalk across the road). Perhaps that's why?
That is most likely why, and likely isn't a big issue. You really need a DEA license to transport the med for disposal, and you would have to really rely on the people to actually dispose it. I know my office doesn't accept meds for this reason
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SupDock 03:22 PM 03-14-2019
Originally Posted by frozenchief:
I disagree based upon my own research and observations. And the reason thatpharmacids won’t fill those scripts is because the DEA has prosecuted doctors for “over-prescribing medications”, even though DEA agents aren’t doctors. I’ve handled those cases as well.
Disagree based on my medical license and DEA license
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frozenchief 03:24 PM 03-14-2019
Originally Posted by SupDock:
Disagree based on my medical license and DEA license
Then we agree to disagree.
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SupDock 03:25 PM 03-14-2019
Originally Posted by frozenchief:
Then we agree to disagree.
so your claim is that you do not risk a physical opiate addiction unless you take the medication for months? That's just completely false

Here is a CDC article addressing this
https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/66/wr/mm6610a1.htm
[Reply]
Holladay 03:27 PM 03-14-2019
Originally Posted by :
Get off them as soon as possible even if you have a some pain. You are hardcore and can handle it. Save the leftovers in case you have a really bad day. That's what I do.

What is you plan for strengthening your ankle when its healed? You'll obviously do some physical therapy, but I always do a little extra. Yoga...weights...shower exercises...whatever.
1st paragraph is spot on. Reading other posts, I will get 800 mg ibuprofen.

2nd paragraph I have a close friend that is a PT. I'll see what he recommends.

In HS, I sprained my left ankle badly. The Doc said it would have been better to have broken it. I had 6 weeks to report to Basic Training. 3 weeks in the cast, then 2.5 weeks doing hydrotherapy involving hot and cold temps: 5 min in ice water doing range of motion, 5 min in hot water, then 4,3,2,1 min. I did that for 2 weeks in the HS boys locker room.

Totally SUCKED. It worked. I was running at Basic. Miracle.

I'm not sure, as an older person, that I have the nads to carry through. I sure as hell gonna try.

Originally Posted by :
Now hyrdrocodone - with a few drinks - that's the stuff.
They gave me some this Hydrocod/Acetam 7.5-325 mg on my first day before surgery. Didn't do squat except made me sleepy.

Originally Posted by :
Are you kidding? Those things make you feel amazing. When I got my wisdom teeth out I was popping one every 2 hours or so and when I stopped I got the worst headache I've ever had in my life.
Nope. Thus OP question

Originally Posted by :
shower exercises
Humm. Reread the first paragraph about PT. Does/could this involve my wife?
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