Originally Posted by staylor26:
The Raiders paying Clowney after drafting Ferrell and Crosby then signing Nasib would be hilarious.
That’s the smart thing to do. You have to have a strong stable of pass rushers to slow down great QB’s. That’s always been true from Brady to Manning to Mahomes.
Throw in some incentives that would not be seen as "likely" so you can get around them (All-Pro? MVP? 15+ sacks?) and sweeten the pot a little bit. Maybe something like each year he gets 15+ sacks he gets $1.5 million (like Pat's MVP/AFC Title incentives).
That gets your cap hit this year down to $10M (saving $6 million). Gets the Chiefs to about $14M in cap room.
Option 1 (Boring): Roll that cap space over to next year to make up for the 2021 salary cap dip
Option 2 (Aggressive):
Add Jadaveon Clowney on a 1-year, $10-12M deal.
Win Super Bowl. Clowney hits FA again at age 28 coming off a SB win and likely a huge year.
Get comp pick when he signs the huge deal he wants.
Profit.
Which do you think Veach is eyeing?
Most likely the aggressive option. Assuming Clowney will take that deal.
Originally Posted by RunKC:
Again it just seems like this was a curveball from Veach. The whole “the Chiefs and Chris Jones aren’t talking” from the media is pretty stupid. No shit they aren’t talking, bc Veach was working on the Mahomes contract.
The “Chiefs never viewed Jones as a $20 million asset” seems odd to me. Not sure why that was reported.
Actions definitely speak louder than words here and Mahomes electing to free money up for the Chiefs the next 4 years says everything about Veach’s plan.
Originally Posted by RunKC:
That’s the smart thing to do. You have to have a strong stable of pass rushers to slow down great QB’s. That’s always been true from Brady to Manning to Mahomes.
That’s your best shot.
Sorry but that’s too much money and resources invested into one position when the rest of their defense is fucking trash outside of Littleton.
Ferrell was a top 5 pick and Crosby looks like a good starter. Paying Clowney makes no sense at this point.
Originally Posted by staylor26:
Sorry but that’s too much money and resources invested into one position when the rest of their defense is fucking trash outside of Littleton.
For that they should’ve paid Jones.
This.
Mahomes is so good under pressure that he will destroy that shit secondary time and time again.
We’ve been on the other side of this too many times. We know what it’s like to have a great pass rush and weak secondary. The best QBs will find your weaknesses and exploit over and over.
Originally Posted by staylor26:
Sorry but that’s too much money and resources invested into one position when the rest of their defense is ****ing trash outside of Littleton.
Ferrell was a top 5 pick and Crosby looks like a good starter. Paying Clowney makes no sense at this point.
For that they should’ve paid Byron Jones.
Eh wouldn’t go that far. Hurst and Collins are pretty decent interior rushers. Not great but pretty solid with 7 sacks the last 2 years for each.
Kwitakowski is statistically a pretty good coverage backer and Mullen was a guy I liked in the draft a couple years ago. Lot of people here liked Amik Robertson too (me included).
Cup isn’t completely bare there but their draft picks have not been great the last 2 years. They got lucky that Crosby has been good.
Passing on Josh Allen for Clelin Ferrell was stupid enough, but passing on Jerry Jeudy for Henry Ruggs? :-)
The chefs miss is Damon Annette. They could have drafted Gladney, McKinney or Igbinoghene and been better off.
Originally Posted by RunKC:
Eh wouldn’t go that far. Hurst and Collins are pretty decent interior rushers. Not great but pretty solid with 7 sacks the last 2 years for each.
Kwitakowski is statistically a pretty good coverage backer and Mullen was a guy I liked in the draft a couple years ago. Lot of people here liked Amik Robertson too (me included).
Cup isn’t completely bare there but their draft picks have not been great the last 2 years. They got lucky that Crosby has been good.
Passing on Josh Allen for Clelin Ferrell was stupid enough, but passing on Jerry Jeudy for Henry Ruggs? :-)
The chefs miss is Damon Annette. They could have drafted Gladney, McKinney or Igbinoghene and been better off.
Holy shit
It’s nowhere close enough to stop or even slow us down. None of those guys are game changers. Adding Clowney is too much investment (money AND draft picks) at one position when the rest of their D needs game changers at every level.
They absolutely would’ve been better off using that money on Byron Jones.
Originally Posted by duncan_idaho:
Yeah, he's looking for the big deal... or MAYBE the short deal that improves his market in 2021.
With KC, Clowney would be able to:
1) Play DE, which maximizes his ability
2) Play on an already stacked DL, with two other pass-rushing terrors to draw attention away from him (seriously, he would face single blockers a LOT)
3) Play for a DC who is creative and will move him around to create easier pass rush opportunities where needed
4) Play for a team that is going to put up a lot of points on offense, forcing opponents to throw the ball a lot, creating pass rush opportunities
I don't know that the huge, multi-year deal Clowney wants is out there for him. If it was, I think it would have materialized by now and he would have taken it.
Clooney is good against the run but just okay pass rushing. He wouldn't be a good fit here
Originally Posted by PAChiefsGuy:
Clooney is good against the run but just okay pass rushing. He wouldn't be a good fit here
Sure he would.
He's a better pass rusher than any other DE not named Frank Clark on this roster. He's not a world-wrecking sack machine like some thought he could be coming out of South Carolina, but he's a good all-around DE who would also be schemed into pressure situations a bunch by this DC and not draw primary focus from offenses.
He's only been used as a 43 E, his best positional fit, or one season (2019) and had no other credible pass rush threats around him.
Originally Posted by PAChiefsGuy:
Clooney is good against the run but just okay pass rushing. He wouldn't be a good fit here
The fuck are you talking about? What do you think Okafor and Suggs we’re doing on the other side of the line? Setting the edge, stopping the run and providing just enough pass rush to help free up Jones and Clark.
Originally Posted by duncan_idaho:
Yeah, he's looking for the big deal... or MAYBE the short deal that improves his market in 2021.
With KC, Clowney would be able to:
1) Play DE, which maximizes his ability
2) Play on an already stacked DL, with two other pass-rushing terrors to draw attention away from him (seriously, he would face single blockers a LOT)
3) Play for a DC who is creative and will move him around to create easier pass rush opportunities where needed
4) Play for a team that is going to put up a lot of points on offense, forcing opponents to throw the ball a lot, creating pass rush opportunities
I don't know that the huge, multi-year deal Clowney wants is out there for him. If it was, I think it would have materialized by now and he would have taken it.
I tell you all the time and over 15+ years I value your insight into players. Your top notch on this site. Without question, one of the best. But, Clowney? Your 4 points above I cant disagree with but if we do that deal, how do we fit Jones in there?
Originally Posted by BigRedChief:
I tell you all the time and over 15+ years I value your insight into players. Your top notch on this site. Without question, one of the best. But, Clowney? Your 4 points above I cant disagree with but if we do that deal, how do we fit Jones in there?
It makes sense. Its not how you fit Jones in there after the fact. The first shoe to drop is getting Jones off the tag, and giving him a longer term deal with a lower 2020 cap hit (vs. his $16M Franchise tag).
If Jones costs only $10M against the cap, you use that found money to swing a deal for Clowney. His 2019 salary was $15M, certainly the ceiling he's looking at now. Maybe you get him to come down to join the Chiefs and make a stat stuffed championship season. The three of them would be a nightmare.
