Originally Posted by Pitt Gorilla:
This. OKC sent up the white flag when they traded Harden for pennies on the dollar. Some OKC idiots thought that the Lamb/Martin return was appropriate, but nobody outside of that area bought that line. It made no sense at the time and it makes no sense now. That was the beginning of the end for OKC. Signing these other clowns to big deals further cements Presti's legacy.
Yep. I thought it was stupid then and believe it is really stupid now. [Reply]
Originally Posted by mcaj22:
Westbrook is the worst of the 3.
If you were drafting and Durant, Harden, Westbrook are all on the board I think you go 1. Durant 2. Harden 3. Westbrook
its hard to construct a scheme around Westbrook and his hero ball. Harden is a beast within a scheme
I'd take Westbrook over Durant and Harden. Harden's D is absolute garbage and Durant isn't loyal. He'll stick with a team but as soon as he has the chance to leave, he will. At least Westbrook remains loyal.
Pure on the court skills I'd probably take Durant because I do feel Westbrook shoots too much as a PG but it's close.
I am concerned about Westbrooks shooting % this postseason. He is shooting 35%. That's horrible. [Reply]
Originally Posted by Nirvana58:
Westbrook is 110% of their offense. He literally can't come out of the game. Seriously what do you expect the guy to do. He ran out of gas in the 4th quarter. Anybody watching the game should be able to see that. He usually gets a rest between the 3rd and 4th quarter. He was dominating and had his team up by 12. In 2 minutes without Westbrook the Rockets cut that lead to 3.
He is the MVP and twice the player Harden is. He put up 51 points, 10 Rebounds, and 13 Assists. That has never been done before. Plus all of his assists were creating basically dunks for his teammates. Since his team literally can't hit anything. Plus they play horrible defense. Without Westbrook this is the worst team in the league. The GM and Coach both need to be fired. Your team isn't stopping anybody on the perimeter you might as well go with the hot hand and play McDermott. But you sit him pretty much the entire second half???
I will even say Westbrook is the better player than both Durant and Harden. Durant should be a monster. He has all the skills in the world but plays zero defense. Hell the Warriors team seems to play better without him. Sad thing is that Westbrook was loyal and stayed with the Thunder and he gets this as repayment.
I understand but at the same time if your other team mates aren't getting\taking shots they are not going to get into any kind of rhythm so you can't expect them to suddenly turn it on.
Originally Posted by mcaj22:
Westbrook is the worst of the 3.
If you were drafting and Durant, Harden, Westbrook are all on the board I think you go 1. Durant 2. Harden 3. Westbrook
its hard to construct a scheme around Westbrook and his hero ball. Harden is a beast within a scheme
Westbrook and Durant together took the Warriors to 7 games and should of won last year to go to the Finals. Durant got in plenty of touches when he played with Westbrook. What does everybody expect Westbrook to do? Seriously look at the Thunders roster and take him off. How does that team even win a game?
Westbrook can play with other superstars and did his entire career. He wasn't even the first option on his team until this year. Which he then goes on to averaging a triple double for the entire NBA season. That is just insane. Hypothetical, switch Westbrook and Harden and I bet the Thunder don't even make the playoffs. [Reply]
Originally Posted by Nirvana58:
Westbrook and Durant together took the Warriors to 7 games and should of won last year to go to the Finals. Durant got in plenty of touches when he played with Westbrook. What does everybody expect Westbrook to do? Seriously look at the Thunders roster and take him off. How does that team even win a game?
Westbrook can play with other superstars and did his entire career. He wasn't even the first option on his team until this year. Which he then goes on to averaging a triple double for the entire NBA season. That is just insane. Hypothetical, switch Westbrook and Harden and I bet the Thunder don't even make the playoffs.
everything you said is a complete hypothetical of course but that was my argument of why I would take Harden over Westbrook.
Of course Westbrook can play with other superstars, that wasn't the debate.
The question is which superstar can elevate the average to good talent around them. Harden is so efficient that guys like Eric Gordon and Clint Capela look like actual NBA players. And if flipped, Westbrook on Houston and Harden on the Thunder, I actually think the Thunder would be better.
Obviously the pieces are worse but Harden paired with Roberson and McBuckets would find a way to make it work. Kanter wouldnt play a minute and you would need a stretch 4 but that's besides the point.
Westbrook on the Rockets I don't think Lou and Gordon and dem boys get the same amount of shots up like they do with Harden, and thus the team would probably lose more games. [Reply]
Originally Posted by mcaj22:
Harden is so efficient that guys like Eric Gordon and Clint Capela look like actual NBA players. And if flipped, Westbrook on Houston and Harden on the Thunder, I actually think the Thunder would be better.
If Harden's efficiency is making Eric Gordon the player he is today, then it would be logical to think that Gordon is playing his best basketball of his career. Let me save you the time. He isnt. His season shooting percentage is the 2nd lowest in his career. His 3 point shooting percentage is the 4th lowest in his career.
The idea that Gordon is exceeding his normal play due to Harden is absolutely absurd, and is not factual whatsoever.
Thunder being better with Harden instead of Russell is not something either of us can prove, but it is indisputable that Harden's supporting cast is better than Russ'. Harden plays with like 4 or 5 players that would be the 2nd best player on the Thunder. [Reply]
Originally Posted by dls6501:
If Harden's efficiency is making Eric Gordon the player he is today, then it would be logical to think that Gordon is playing his best basketball of his career. Let me save you the time. He isnt. His season shooting percentage is the 2nd lowest in his career. His 3 point shooting percentage is the 4th lowest in his career.
The idea that Gordon is exceeding his normal play due to Harden is absolutely absurd, and is not factual whatsoever.
Thunder being better with Harden instead of Russell is not something either of us can prove, but it is indisputable that Harden's supporting cast is better than Russ'. Harden plays with like 4 or 5 players that would be the 2nd best player on the Thunder.
Eric Gordon's efficiency is moot the guy is getting the most 3 point looks of his career. Averaged almost 9 attempts this year, that's almost 3 more attempts than he's ever gotten for his career in a season. His efficiency may have dipped but hes getting way more looks from an efficient Superstar in Harden that finds him.
It was my argument on why Harden would have hit Doug McDermott all 3 times open and Westbrook didnt. Gordon was 3rd in the NBA in 3PA this year and still shot 37 percent, if you want to use a straw argument that doesn't stack up to his 44 percent season when he was getting 5 attempts per game fine. I don't care that Gordon isn't efficient, I care that Harden is more efficient than Westbrook. That's the indisputable fact here. I'm not the one arguing that Westbrook is better, because he's not. You want to use stats for Eric Gordon then I can use stats for James Harden, he beats Westbrook in almost everything, I'll save you the time. [Reply]
Originally Posted by PAChiefsGuy:
I'd take Westbrook over Durant and Harden. Harden's D is absolute garbage and Durant isn't loyal. He'll stick with a team but as soon as he has the chance to leave, he will. At least Westbrook remains loyal.
Pure on the court skills I'd probably take Durant because I do feel Westbrook shoots too much as a PG but it's close.
I am concerned about Westbrooks shooting % this postseason. He is shooting 35%. That's horrible.
Actually, I'm pretty sure Westbrook was worse on defense this year. He had less than 300 contested shots this year. Pathetic. Dude was always camping in the lane. The only comparable players (2500+ minutes) were Caldwell-Pope with 339 and Kyrie Irving with 361 [Reply]
Originally Posted by Nirvana58:
Westbrook and Durant together took the Warriors to 7 games and should of won last year to go to the Finals. Durant got in plenty of touches when he played with Westbrook. What does everybody expect Westbrook to do? Seriously look at the Thunders roster and take him off. How does that team even win a game?
Westbrook can play with other superstars and did his entire career. He wasn't even the first option on his team until this year. Which he then goes on to averaging a triple double for the entire NBA season. That is just insane. Hypothetical, switch Westbrook and Harden and I bet the Thunder don't even make the playoffs.
Bullshit. Harden is a fucking winner. Look at these bumass rosters from 2012-2014. 99 wins and two playoff appearances in the two season.
Originally Posted by Rudy won the toss:
Bullshit. Harden is a ****ing winner. Look at these bumass rosters from 2012-2014. 99 wins and two playoff appearances in the two season.
Both of those rosters are head and shoulders better than this current Thunder team. Seriously the current Thunder team is laughable if you take Westbrook out of the equation. [Reply]
Originally Posted by Nirvana58:
Both of those rosters are head and shoulders better than this current Thunder team. Seriously the current Thunder team is laughable if you take Westbrook out of the equation.
I'll give you 13-14, but not 12-13. 45 wins with that crew is more impressive. [Reply]
The Rockets were not projected to be good this year. They weren't projected to be close to this. They are one of the biggest surprises of the year and thats in part to Harden and D'Antoni. (Yes the same D'Antoni that was a failure on the Lakers and started this current crapfest downfall the New York Knicks are on)
Rockets took spare parts, literally a broken down Nene and platooned him with a guy named Clint Capela. They signed Eric Gordon to what clearly is now a very good looking deal for them so far, under market value. They paid probably top dollar for Ryan Anderson and were laughed at.
Basically took the spare parts from NO that Anthony Davis couldn't win with that were labeled injury prone players and have given them more open looks than they have seen in their entire careers.
Now you're saying they are better than the Thunder because you saw what the team can do this year, yo guess what the THUNDER HAVE 4 MAX CONTRACTS ON THEIR TEAM THE ROCKETS HAVE NOTHING CLOSE TO THAT.
You can say its because of bad GMing all you want, but the Thunder are paying way more for their talent and they are getting way less out of it, scheme, coaching whatever. But if you want to say James Harden is only better than Westbrook because Eric Gordon is better than Oladipo (who is making almost 10 million more than Eric Gordon) then I'm going to laugh at you and call you an idiot. [Reply]