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The Lounge>Anyone ever experience burnout?
Mecca 02:45 PM 07-30-2020
I feel like I'm there, I was there before Covid and feel like it's worse now. I legit have no motivation to do anything and I know I'm pessimistic and not fun to be around for the most part. If anyone wants further stuff I can deep dive but I need some advice because I feel like I'm stuck in the wallow not to escape.
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O.city 07:33 AM 08-01-2020
We have a group of about 8 guys that I went to dental school with who are all in similar places in life. Married, young kids, practice owners etc.

We have once a month “round table” discussions where we vent, talk, scream laugh whatever anyone wants. Once it’s done nothing leaves the conversation, but it’s a great way to get it out.

I have a really close friend who was my best man who is again in a similar situation. We talk for about an hour every night.

Point being, talk to people about anything. Listen to others talk to you. Sometimes things work themselves out better when you say them out loud you realize “damn, that’s dumb to stress over”.

I have an extremely close relationship with my dad. He’s always my first call anytime I have any issue or good news or questions.
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O.city 07:36 AM 08-01-2020
We’ve in the infancy of the “social media tribes” and we don’t know how to cope. We evolved having small groups or tribes for protection and comfort. It’s weird times.

Read, listen, have patience, enjoy things that in the grand scheme don’t really even matter. Breathing exercises have helped me immensely.

Of course there’s also banging 20 year olds. The end will be a train wreck of epic proportions but I’m guessing the ride down will be super fun
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stevieray 07:41 AM 08-01-2020
Originally Posted by O.city:


I have an extremely close relationship with my dad. Heís always my first call anytime I have any issue or good news or questions.
So fortunate.

My Dad would've been 82 last Friday. Lost him when he was 47.

Still wish I could call him and ask for advice
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O.city 07:44 AM 08-01-2020
Originally Posted by stevieray:
So fortunate.

My Dad would've been 82 last Friday. Lost him when he was 47.

Still wish I could call him and ask for advice
Yeah Iím glad to still have him around. Only problem I have woth him is he thinks he can fix everything which he for the most part can and hates it when I canít and I just call someone to come fix it.
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stevieray 08:02 AM 08-01-2020
Originally Posted by O.city:
Yeah Iím glad to still have him around. Only problem I have woth him is he thinks he can fix everything which he for the most part can and hates it when I canít and I just call someone to come fix it.
:-)
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scho63 08:14 AM 08-01-2020
There is no more simpler line of reasoning than this:

YOUR life is too short and too important to let others control how you think, feel and act.

If you allow your life to be dictated by others, you will lead a miserable unhappy life.
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stevieray 08:22 AM 08-01-2020
Originally Posted by eDave:
You ever experienced it in your line? Perhaps an artistic block (like writers block)?
Sometimes.

I get burnt out on being "on stage" more than anything else.
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Buehler445 09:04 AM 08-01-2020
Originally Posted by O.city:
We have a group of about 8 guys that I went to dental school with who are all in similar places in life. Married, young kids, practice owners etc.

We have once a month ďround tableĒ discussions where we vent, talk, scream laugh whatever anyone wants. Once itís done nothing leaves the conversation, but itís a great way to get it out.

I have a really close friend who was my best man who is again in a similar situation. We talk for about an hour every night.

Point being, talk to people about anything. Listen to others talk to you. Sometimes things work themselves out better when you say them out loud you realize ďdamn, thatís dumb to stress overĒ.

I have an extremely close relationship with my dad. Heís always my first call anytime I have any issue or good news or questions.
That's really good.

I have a buddy that we vent to each other about with those understandings. I'm a customer of his though, so on a couple issues we tread a little lightly, but as long as we both understand that these are our livelihoods it won't ever be a problem.

Originally Posted by scho63:
There is no more simpler line of reasoning than this:

YOUR life is too short and too important to let others control how you think, feel and act.

If you allow your life to be dictated by others, you will lead a miserable unhappy life.
Largely yeah, but families change the dynamic. My brothers fat bitch wife (I'm speculating obviously) got that advice from a marriage counselor and promptly divorced my brother.

I guess it wouldn't be exclusively limited to families. You have to be you, but you can't just be an asshole to everyone that's not you.
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Bearcat 11:02 AM 08-01-2020
Originally Posted by DJ's left nut:

Heard a quote once that was essentially "The problem is that people get everything they were after and suddenly realize that their dreams were too small..."

Some people prefer the hunt to the spoils.
Originally Posted by WilliamTheIrish:

Week one: I was already looking for another position. Didn't even know why. But just had to go.
Originally Posted by scho63:
If you allow your life to be dictated by others, you will lead a miserable unhappy life.
A lot of great stuff in this thread.

Another IT perspective. I've had consecutive months of 80 hour work weeks/~320 hour months, where it almost becomes a competition with yourself to see how much shit you can get done (and hoping it pays off during review time). It was quite literally sleep, getting ready for work, driving a few minutes to work, work, driving home from work, work... and some food in there while working.

And for the first several years of IT, I would always be looking for something else... maybe not week 1 of a new job, but it certainly didn't take long. I would always want to know what was out there.

My 2Ę...

You better love what you do, and don't be afraid to try something completely different if you're in a rut.

As many others have said, find things and people that will make it all worth it... whether that's volunteering, making beer, social distancing in the woods, etc.

Originally Posted by DJ's left nut:
It's the whole theory of the "God shaped hole".

I don't adhere to any faith so that exact iteration doesn't scan with me, but the theory does. The idea is that if you identify yourself by your faith and theoretically faith is built on love and forgiveness, then your anchor is something built on love and forgiveness and your overall countenance will be built accordingly.

...

I don't expect everyone's anchor to be their faith (though I will concede that the people I know who do tend to be very happy people as a whole), but man - it can't be something as pernicious as politics.
I was thinking my hot take would take this in a bit of a different direction, but you already hit the nail on the head.... the other day I read something about creating your own personal philosophy/tagline/vision, much like corporations do with mission statements. Think about what you value most, then live by it everyday, through your job, hobbies, etc. And not just at a high level, but to really think about it on a daily basis, to say you're making decisions and doing things in the name of your philosophy and values, so you get more meaning out of what you do.

And if what you're doing doesn't align with what you value the most, then find the things that do.
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BryanBusby 02:35 PM 08-01-2020
Originally Posted by Bearcat:
Another IT perspective. I've had consecutive months of 80 hour work weeks/~320 hour months
From another IT persons PoV, do not do this. Absolutely do not work like this, or work somewhere where this is expected out of you.

This will burn anyone out, regardless of profession. I left Warehouse management because it was getting to that level.

I work my 40 hours per week and I am done. My burn out comes from all the extra time studying and other shit that comes with it. But if you can't get the work done in 40, well that's on management to figure that problem out.
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Bearcat 03:35 PM 08-01-2020
Originally Posted by BryanBusby:
From another IT persons PoV, do not do this. Absolutely do not work like this, or work somewhere where this is expected out of you.

This will burn anyone out, regardless of profession. I left Warehouse management because it was getting to that level.

I work my 40 hours per week and I am done. My burn out comes from all the extra time studying and other shit that comes with it. But if you can't get the work done in 40, well that's on management to figure that problem out.
Yeah, it's just not sustainable in the long term. Once a few years ago, I had been working so freakin' much over a 3-4 month period, it took me 4 nights into my vacation to stop dreaming about work.

I think it's all about what you're expecting to get out of the work and what you're getting back for your efforts.

I've been asked by college kids, "will I have to work more than 40 hours/week", and I want to tell them they picked the wrong industry and that's certainly not the attitude someone should have early in their career.... and I've heard people who work 40.0000 hours/week bitch about never seeing a decent raise.

I've also heard plenty of people say they put in tons of hours and never see any benefit at review time, much less recognition or anything else.

I'd tell early career people to work hard and work a lot, but don't get abused. There are a lot of industries where you're simply expected to work OT at times, whether it's seasonal/fiscal year end/project go lives/etc. That doesn't mean you should be expected to work 50+ hours/week and then 60 or 70 or 80 hours/week during crunch time... it's something you definitely have to manage to avoid complete burnout (the kind that can't be fixed by a week of vacation).

OTOH, if your company isn't rewarding you at review time, either find a new company or stop working so much for them.
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BryanBusby 06:39 PM 08-01-2020
Originally Posted by Bearcat:
Yeah, it's just not sustainable in the long term. Once a few years ago, I had been working so freakin' much over a 3-4 month period, it took me 4 nights into my vacation to stop dreaming about work.

I think it's all about what you're expecting to get out of the work and what you're getting back for your efforts.

I've been asked by college kids, "will I have to work more than 40 hours/week", and I want to tell them they picked the wrong industry and that's certainly not the attitude someone should have early in their career.... and I've heard people who work 40.0000 hours/week bitch about never seeing a decent raise.

I've also heard plenty of people say they put in tons of hours and never see any benefit at review time, much less recognition or anything else.

I'd tell early career people to work hard and work a lot, but don't get abused. There are a lot of industries where you're simply expected to work OT at times, whether it's seasonal/fiscal year end/project go lives/etc. That doesn't mean you should be expected to work 50+ hours/week and then 60 or 70 or 80 hours/week during crunch time... it's something you definitely have to manage to avoid complete burnout (the kind that can't be fixed by a week of vacation).

OTOH, if your company isn't rewarding you at review time, either find a new company or stop working so much for them.
I think people in IT try to be the company gem when they come in and try to get a project over the hump by putting in more hours. Over time, they come to expect it.

Work a productive 40 from the start and just don't give them the expectation you're gonna work another 20 every week. If you get a rash of shit for it, move on or demand more salary to compensate.

Too many workers underestimate their power in not pandemic times.
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lcarus 06:56 PM 08-01-2020
Burnout? Fuck yes I have. Worked for the same company for 18 years. Same company I had worked since I turned 19. Got pretty burned out there to say the least. Then in April, the virus ended the company so I've been sitting on my ding dong for the last 4 months not knowing what the hell I'm gonna do next.
[Reply]
BigRedChief 07:01 PM 08-01-2020
Originally Posted by Bearcat:
A lot of great stuff in this thread.

Another IT perspective. I've had consecutive months of 80 hour work weeks/~320 hour months, where it almost becomes a competition with yourself to see how much shit you can get done (and hoping it pays off during review time). It was quite literally sleep, getting ready for work, driving a few minutes to work, work, driving home from work, work... and some food in there while working.

And for the first several years of IT, I would always be looking for something else... maybe not week 1 of a new job, but it certainly didn't take long. I would always want to know what was out there.

My 2Ę...

You better love what you do, and don't be afraid to try something completely different if you're in a rut.

As many others have said, find things and people that will make it all worth it... whether that's volunteering, making beer, social distancing in the woods, etc.
Yeah, I think this is universal to all I.T. No matter the part of I.T. your in. All the issues you see are probably happening at the shop down the street. Grass isnt greener.

There was a period of 10-15 years when I pursued the biggest projects at the biggest companies using the latest tech. But, it came at the cost you mention 70-80 hour work weeks. Got paid well but eventually burned out.

To the OP I've changed careers and career paths when I wasn't happy. It was a gamble each time. Its really hard to do when you have a family to support. Just plan it out. Get your wife and family to buy in to this new path.

Originally Posted by BryanBusby:
I work my 40 hours per week and I am done. My burn out comes from all the extra time studying and other shit that comes with it. But if you can't get the work done in 40, well that's on management to figure that problem out.
We swapped resumes didn't we? I have 20+ technical certifications. Not a single one braindumped. I have to do this shit in the real world. Cant shortcut the tech or yourself in the real world. You cant hide. Everyone will know your tech skills in a few months anyway. I'll set aside time on the weekend to deep dive into the new tech. I'll watch a baseball game and set up stuff to practice with. I do still love the learning of new tech. That helps.
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BigRedChief 07:15 PM 08-01-2020
Originally Posted by eDave:
Might as well post the entire movie.

A big contributing factor to my burnout was working from home for so long and the time it afforded me to do more work, sometimes for two different companies at the same time). I'd like to go back to co-location but just seeing the office in that clip kinda sickens me. I don't know how I could survive cubical life. And the long ass frustrating commute.
I get that too. I've worked remotely for 7.5 of the last 8 years. At first I was obsessed with proving I could be productive and work from home. I did a lot of extra work. I stopped after about 2 years when I realized it wasn't sustainable. No ****ing way I'm ever going back to cubicle work. I'll go for a little while to a client site when doing a restore from a ransomware attack but thats only a couple of weeks.

To the OP about working remote..... I had a lot of the same issues you mentioned. I think you need a distraction away from your job. Something totally different.

When my son was young and wanted to play competitive baseball team, I managed the team. Working in tech all day, then being around a kids game played in the dirt and grass worked for me. When I moved to Florida I missed watching the Chiefs with other Chief fans. I started Arrowhead South. Spent a lot of my leisure time building it out, getting chapters up and going. No money involved. Just a love of the Chiefs and definitely a non tech activity.

Whatever you have a passion for, set some time aside for it no matter what, it'll keep you sane.
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