Originally Posted by ChiefsFanatic:
I would switch Hill and Schwartz. I believe it's very likely that Schwartz makes it into the HOF if he ends his career with a total of 3 rings, and plays at or near the same level for the duration.
I think if he continues to put up numbers, Hill may get in, but it will probably be in the second window. I think he will more than likely need to improve his reputation significantly during his playing days. Whether he is innocent or not, or whether his current reputation is earned or not, it will affect the voters.
Once his son is 18, if he publicly stated that he was never abused by Tyreek, that might go a long way to helping Tyreek make a case.
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The thing that will hurt Schwartz is that when the voters look at his record, he won't have any (or many) pro bowls, and that's often how linemen are judged. The only reason he doesn't get pro bowls because they always put left tackles in there instead of right tackles, which I think is a travesty. But in the end, it'll hurt him.
So that brings up a question. Is Schwartz a right tackle because he can't play left tackle? Is right tackle solely a position for players who are lesser than left tackles? I think that's the perception, but more and more we see good pass rushers lining up on the strong side, and half the time the tight ends are moving around so the strong side isn't even the strong side any more. I think Schwartz is being victimized by an antiquated view of what the right tackle does. [Reply]
Originally Posted by Rain Man:
The thing that will hurt Schwartz is that when the voters look at his record, he won't have any (or many) pro bowls, and that's often how linemen are judged. The only reason he doesn't get pro bowls because they always put left tackles in there instead of right tackles, which I think is a travesty. But in the end, it'll hurt him.
So that brings up a question. Is Schwartz a right tackle because he can't play left tackle? Is right tackle solely a position for players who are lesser than left tackles? I think that's the perception, but more and more we see good pass rushers lining up on the strong side, and half the time the tight ends are moving around so the strong side isn't even the strong side any more. I think Schwartz is being victimized by an antiquated view of what the right tackle does.
He definitely had no shortage of talent lining up against him in 2019 -- something I didn't fully appreciate until watching Kollmann this week. Pretty telling that the Niners did not line Bosa up against Schwartz a single time. Watching Kollmann made me realize that an all talent, high motor guy like Ford really did not have a chance against Mitch (especially with Ford's injury). [Reply]
Originally Posted by Chiefspants:
He definitely had no shortage of talent lining up against him in 2019 -- something I didn't fully appreciate until watching Kollmann this week. Pretty telling that the Niners did not line Bosa up against Schwartz a single time. Watching Kollmann made me realize that an all talent, high motor guy like Ford really did not have a chance against Mitch (especially with Ford's injury).
A lot of WR's burn fast and bright, then fade quickly.
The NFL isn't quite like MLB in this regard, but for many players, it's not their peak that gets them in the hall - it's the latter half of their careers.
You look at guys like Tom Glavine - Had he gotten hurt at 33 years old, he'd have probably been a fringe guy who just didn't quite get over the hump. But he was an effective pitcher for another 6-8 years after that, won another 120 games and got in.
CC Sabathia had as good/better a career going through age 31 as Glavine then crashed and burned. I doubt he gets there.
Tyreek Hill isn't gonna qualify under the 'Sandy Koufax/Gale Sayers' sort of 'was transcendent for 5 years' umbrella. Not in the passing age with exploding receiving stats.
He needs to have Steve Smith's longevity. And in about 5 years, we can start to have that conversation.
Tyreek is built like a brick shit house. I'm confident he'll get there. [Reply]
Originally Posted by RealSNR:
Tyreek is built like a brick shit house. I'm confident he'll get there.
Yeah, gun to my head I'd say he'll age well.
But you can't know until you know. And the NFL is littered w/ fluke injuries. I'm pretty sure Hill's legs are built in such a way that he could cut harder than most guys without ligaments in his knee at all so he's going to be pretty well protected there. And those short strides should keep him from being over-exposed.
Everything in terms of his build suggests durability - but weird shit happens in this game. [Reply]
Tyreek's game is a pretty good mix of prime Steve Smith and Desean Jackson. They both aged fairly well so I'd imagine Hill has a good chance of doing so as well.
The fact that he's rounded out his game and is not just a fast gadget player gives me a lot of hope. You could make Reek a 4.5 guy and he probably wouldn't be elite anymore but he'd still be better than average. If he's able to retain his legendary speed as well as guys like Darrell Green and Deion Sanders the sky really is the limit. [Reply]
Originally Posted by ThaVirus:
Tyreek's game is a pretty good mix of prime Steve Smith and Desean Jackson. They both aged fairly well so I'd imagine Hill has a good chance of doing so as well.
The fact that he's rounded out his game and is not just a fast gadget player gives me a lot of hope. You could make Reek a 4.5 guy and he probably wouldn't be elite anymore but he'd still be better than average. If he's able to retain his legendary speed as well as guys like Darrell Green and Deion Sanders the sky really is the limit.
Using baseball analogies again - guys like Ricky Henderson and Kenny Lofton aged really well. Vince Coleman was a trash baseball player who couldn't get on base to save his life and he stole 50 bases in the partial '94 season at 32 yrs old.
Having speed to spare helps because when you lose some, you still have plenty. And that's how it went for some of those hyper-athletic guys. [Reply]
