Originally Posted by staylor26:
So Mahomes’ team and people at TT are in on this too. Even though they give most of the credit to Veach and his persistence about Pat it’s all just bullshit propaganda. Got it.
Buttfucking moron.
Dorsey and Reid deserve their credit too, but Veach was in on Mahomes well before he was a well known prospect.
Originally Posted by Chiefshrink:
This is all on Andy and Veach is just a yes man that brings him players to look at so if you want to say Veach sucks in general at finding good players and is great at playing up poor players then ok. Veach's only real trophies are discovering Shady and Mahomes and granted those are huge players BUT YOU HAVE TO BE MORE CONSISTENT ACROSS THE BOARD IN ALL THE POSITIONS on the field. It is clear Andy and Brett are not.
“Andy” seemed so much better at drafting with Dorsey and Ballard around. Weird. [Reply]
It is but being a good GM is about more than hitting on one pick. I'd like to know what other picks Veach liked or disliked when he was a scout here. [Reply]
Originally Posted by Pitt Gorilla:
“Andy” seemed so much better at drafting with Dorsey and Ballard around. Weird.
They drafted particularly well on offense.
We are still capable of finding talent on offense. Nothing has changed.
We haven’t drafted nearly as well defensively in Reid’s tenure (which could also be partly due to coaching/development).
You really think we need Dorsey to find guys like Mahomes, Kelce, Hill, and Hunt? Reid and Veach will have no problem finding offensive talent.
They also had more to work with in terms of draft picks. Veach has been picking at the bottom of the draft with no 1st for 2 years now, granted one of those was his choice, but the fact still remains.
Originally Posted by staylor26:
They drafted particularly well on offense.
We are still capable of finding talent on offense. Nothing has changed.
We haven’t drafted nearly as well defensively in Reid’s tenure (which could also be partly due to coaching/development).
You really think we need Dorsey to find guys like Kelce, Hill, and Hunt? Reid and Veach will have no problem finding offensive talent.
They also had more to work with in terms of draft picks. Veach has been picking at the bottom of the draft with no 1st for 2 years now, granted one of those was his choice, but the fact still remains.
Get a ****ing clue dude.
Hes had 2 drafts where are they at? Seems like most his middle roubd guys are all on the bench and some of the later round guys arent even on the team. [Reply]
Originally Posted by Titty Meat:
Hes had 2 drafts where are they at? Seems like most his middle roubd guys are all on the bench and some of the later round guys arent even on the team.
Nnadi, Hardman, and Thornhill were good picks.
Speaks, DOD, and Saunders have not shown anything.
He’s batting .500 now. About what you’d expect with day 2 picks.
Mid/late round picks are not supposed to be starters, so I hardly see your point there.
The numbers show you’re more likely to hit on an UDFA, which we’ve done a decent job with (Williams and Pringle for example).
I’m not saying Veach has been great, but you guys are ignoring anything good that he’s done and it’s an unfair judgement. [Reply]
Originally Posted by staylor26:
Nnadi, Hardman, and Thornhill were good picks.
Speaks, DOD, and Saunders have not shown anything.
He’s batting .500 now. About what you’d expect with day 2 picks.
Mid/late round picks are not supposed to be starters, so I hardly see your point there.
But LDT, Hill, Kelce, Hunt etc all were mid to late round picks and were starters. I'll give credit on the 3 you mentioned as good picks but none are really impact players. Hardman could be if he developes his route running, Thornhill is seemingly improving each week but I dont see the impact player type from him. [Reply]
I'm not saying he hasnt done anything good but I am saying the same holes are there from when he took over 2 years ago and I'm not sure the roster overall haant regressed since then too. [Reply]
Originally Posted by Titty Meat:
But LDT, Hill, Kelce, Hunt etc all were mid to late round picks and were starters. I'll give credit on the 3 you mentioned as good picks but none are really impact players. Hardman could be if he developes his route running, Thornhill is seemingly improving each week but I dont see the impact player type from him.
Kelce and Hunt were day 2 picks, just like the guys I mentioned.
Yea he hasn’t found any mid to late round starters through the draft, but he’s found guys like Reiter, Wylie, and Ward who are starters. You’re too fixated on how these starters were acquired in the past. Veach has found cheap solid starters in other ways. What difference does it make whether they were drafted or not?
Not to mention there’s still plenty of time for a guy like Darwin to become a starter. We’re 5 games into this year class’s careers. Those guys you mentioned that Dorsey acquired weren’t starters this early. That’s what I mean by “unfair”.
By the way, Kelce and Hunt were 100% Reid picks anyways. They would’ve been made regardless of who is the GM. You know that, right? [Reply]
Originally Posted by staylor26:
Kelce and Hunt were day 2 picks, just like the guys I mentioned.
Yea he hasn’t found any mid to late round starters through the draft, but he’s found guys like Reiter, Wylie, and Ward who are starters. You’re too fixated on how these starters were acquired in the past. Veach has found cheap solid starters in other ways. What difference does it make whether they were drafted or not?
Not to mention there’s still plenty of time for a guy like Darwin to become a starter. We’re 5 games into this year class’s careers. Those guys you mentioned that Dorsey acquired weren’t starters this early.
By the way, Kelce and Hunt were 100% Reid picks anyways. They would’ve been made regardless of who is the GM. You know that, right?
Reiter and Wylie are the reason Mahomes likely wont finish the year. They are awful and never should have been starters dude they weren't even good last year.
How they were acquired aside he really hasnt added any impact players aside from Watkins who's made of glass and Mathieu.
We are 5 games in so I'll be willing to admit that I was wrong if different guys step up but the way Clark is playing could be a huge face plant and that Hitchens deal was atrocious. You cant keep whiffing like that man. [Reply]
Originally Posted by JakeF:
Has Veach's drafting since supported that rumor?
On the other hand, Dorsey turned around the worse franchise in the NFL in a single year. Even if Cleveland isn't the super bowl contender people say they still went from a total abomination to a playoff contender is a single season. People have been trying to turn Cleveland around for decades without success and Dorsey did it without breaking a sweat.
Let’s not forget the sacrificial GM that afforded Dorsey all those picks.
When Dorse came here he had #1 pick and #1 shot at claiming other team cast offs. [Reply]
Originally Posted by Titty Meat:
Reiter and Wylie are the reason Mahomes likely wont finish the year. They are awful and never should have been starters dude they weren't even good last year.
How they were acquired aside he really hasnt added any impact players aside from Watkins who's made of glass and Mathieu.
We are 5 games in so I'll be willing to admit that I was wrong if different guys step up but the way Clark is playing could be a huge face plant and that Hitchens deal was atrocious. You cant keep whiffing like that man.
Oh and LDT has just been phenomenal at a much cheaper price huh? Wylie and Reiter are fine and if the rest of our OL/offense were healthy, they wouldn’t look nearly as bad. If Wylie and Reiter being starters were our biggest problem on offense, we’d be 5-0 putting up 30+ every game.
What about Okafor? Ogbah? Breeland? Wilson?
Again, you are ignoring any of his good moves. [Reply]
Originally Posted by Titty Meat:
Reiter and Wylie are the reason Mahomes likely wont finish the year. They are awful and never should have been starters dude they weren't even good last year.
How they were acquired aside he really hasnt added any impact players aside from Watkins who's made of glass and Mathieu.
We are 5 games in so I'll be willing to admit that I was wrong if different guys step up but the way Clark is playing could be a huge face plant and that Hitchens deal was atrocious. You cant keep whiffing like that man.
They’re good backups for sure but I don’t like counting on them to start more than a few games.
This is what happens when you don’t have draft picks or you just simply blow them.
Trading for Alex=no 2nd for 2 years
Maclin penalty=no 3rd
Mahomes trade=loss of a 1st
Clark=loss of 1st and 2nd rd pick
Both of those QB trades were great for us IMO but the point is we didn’t have picks. That is hard when you can’t use that resource to surround your QB with talent.
Need to hit on the draft. That’s the best way to win in this league [Reply]
