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Nzoner's Game Room>***NON-POLITICAL COVID-19 Discussion Thread***
JakeF 10:28 PM 02-26-2020
A couple of reminders...

Originally Posted by Bwana:
Once again, don't come in this thread with some kind of political agenda, or you will be shown the door. If you want to go that route, there is a thread about this in DC.
Originally Posted by Dartgod:
People, there is a lot of good information in this thread, let's try to keep the petty bickering to a minimum.

We all have varying opinions about the impact of this, the numbers, etc. We will all never agree with each other. But we can all keep it civil.

Thanks!

Click here for the original OP:

Spoiler!

[Reply]
Pants 02:47 PM 08-20-2020
Originally Posted by petegz28:
He keeps beating that drum without or refusing to realize that you can only mitigate so much. The virus hasn't and isn't going away. So you either mitgate yourself into oblivion or you accept the fact that all mitigation is temporary at best.

The answer is treatments and a vaccine.
What drum are you beating?

Let's try to stay away from the "jeez, I was just kidding" stuff. Real answer only, please.
[Reply]
O.city 02:52 PM 08-20-2020
Originally Posted by Donger:
Wouldn't you say that it HAS worked in New Zealand? It's what they've done and what they are doing.
Unless it's going to happen in other countries, in the end, it's kind of futile.

You have population fatigue and economic issues. They're only meant to basically occur in very short amount of times.
[Reply]
O.city 02:55 PM 08-20-2020
So we now know that most mild infections down seroconvert, but have been shown to have developed long standing "innate" immunity thru T cell activation.

We would then know, that in itself is going to show how serology testing is going to undercount pretty significantly the amount of cleared infections and immunity, no?

Is this thing on?
[Reply]
O.city 02:59 PM 08-20-2020
Texas hospitalizations are continuing to fall and are about to levels they were in early June. So thats good news.
[Reply]
dirk digler 03:09 PM 08-20-2020
Originally Posted by O.city:
Would have to see what areas of those countries.

Italy was the northern area hit hard the first time, looks like the problems now are in the South.

Kinda going thru the same things we are.
We are just going to have to hold out hope that the vaccines work I am afraid. It is just going to be like whack a mole because it is to infectious.
[Reply]
O.city 03:13 PM 08-20-2020
Originally Posted by dirk digler:
We are just going to have to hold out hope that the vaccines work I am afraid. It is just going to be like whack a mole because it is to infectious.
Why wouldn't vaccines work?
[Reply]
Donger 03:16 PM 08-20-2020
Originally Posted by O.city:
Texas hospitalizations are continuing to fall and are about to levels they were in early June. So thats good news.
That's great news. Arizona positivity is now the same as it was in early June, too.
[Reply]
petegz28 03:17 PM 08-20-2020
Originally Posted by Pants:
What drum are you beating?

Let's try to stay away from the "jeez, I was just kidding" stuff. Real answer only, please.
Your snarky shit aside the drum I don't know that I am beating any particular drum. I prefer to let the data help form my opinions and that includes economic as well as medical data.

I prefer not to approach things with the false notion that we can mitigate this virus into non-existence. At least not in the near term and definitely not without completely destroying our economy.

The bottom line is as long as the virus exists you are going to deal with it. You can mitigate an area down to x number of cases but most likely and as we are seeing elsewhere, it will come back. I know there is this pipe dream of "if we get it low enough and do this contact tracing and lock down this and loosen up that and this thing does the other thing" that we can somehow get ourselves "back to normal".

I mentioned this yesterday to an extent, we are at a point now where we have to start managing possibilities vs. probabilities. There isn't any one size fits all answer. There isn't any magic mitigation method. In theory there might very well be but reality doesn't permit those theories to exist.
[Reply]
petegz28 03:20 PM 08-20-2020
Originally Posted by dirk digler:
We are just going to have to hold out hope that the vaccines work I am afraid. It is just going to be like whack a mole because it is to infectious.
We need therapeutics before a vaccine. I know the word "vaccine" makes everyone feel all warm and fuzzy. It's like watching the movies when the Villain is the only one with the "anti-dote".

The reality is if we can find ways to treat it like we have ways to treat influenza and such then a vaccine is gravy and won't need to be rushed so much thus hopefully getting us something better sooner.
[Reply]
dirk digler 03:32 PM 08-20-2020
Originally Posted by O.city:
Why wouldn't vaccines work?
I am confidant they will because this virus doesn't mutate much. Dr Fauci said they are preparing human challenges trials just in case though.
[Reply]
dirk digler 03:35 PM 08-20-2020
Originally Posted by petegz28:
We need therapeutics before a vaccine. I know the word "vaccine" makes everyone feel all warm and fuzzy. It's like watching the movies when the Villain is the only one with the "anti-dote".

The reality is if we can find ways to treat it like we have ways to treat influenza and such then a vaccine is gravy and won't need to be rushed so much thus hopefully getting us something better sooner.
Just like not having a major testing break through we really haven't had a therapeutics breakthrough. At this pace a vaccine will be ready before a good therapeutic will.
[Reply]
petegz28 03:40 PM 08-20-2020
Originally Posted by dirk digler:
Just like not having a major testing break through we really haven't had a therapeutics breakthrough. At this pace a vaccine will be ready before a good therapeutic will.
How effective do you think that vaccine is really going to be? Fauci himself has said he doesn't think that it will be highly effective at frist and a lot of experts have said we are 5-10 years away from a real vaccine in the way of the flu vaccine.

Even so, people can and most likely will still get this even after a vaccine for a while. So I go back to treating it. I mean if I don't get it then great but what happens if\when I do?

Therapeutics......
[Reply]
Pants 03:41 PM 08-20-2020
Originally Posted by petegz28:
Your snarky shit aside the drum I don't know that I am beating any particular drum. I prefer to let the data help form my opinions and that includes economic as well as medical data.

I prefer not to approach things with the false notion that we can mitigate this virus into non-existence. At least not in the near term and definitely not without completely destroying our economy.

The bottom line is as long as the virus exists you are going to deal with it. You can mitigate an area down to x number of cases but most likely and as we are seeing elsewhere, it will come back. I know there is this pipe dream of "if we get it low enough and do this contact tracing and lock down this and loosen up that and this thing does the other thing" that we can somehow get ourselves "back to normal".

I mentioned this yesterday to an extent, we are at a point now where we have to start managing possibilities vs. probabilities. There isn't any one size fits all answer. There isn't any magic mitigation method. In theory there might very well be but reality doesn't permit those theories to exist.
Oh. Based on your Sweden posts, I thought your drum was no mitigation and letting this thing just run its course.
[Reply]
Pants 03:43 PM 08-20-2020
Originally Posted by petegz28:
We need therapeutics before a vaccine. I know the word "vaccine" makes everyone feel all warm and fuzzy. It's like watching the movies when the Villain is the only one with the "anti-dote".

The reality is if we can find ways to treat it like we have ways to treat influenza and such then a vaccine is gravy and won't need to be rushed so much thus hopefully getting us something better sooner.
I am not sure therapeutics are ever going to be possible given the nature of this virus. I think vaccines are a much more likely path to success.
[Reply]
petegz28 03:43 PM 08-20-2020
Originally Posted by Pants:
Oh. Based on your Sweden posts, I thought your drum was no mitigation and letting this thing just run its course.
Well, truth be told I think there is a bit of method to that madness. Obviously not for everyone but I think in general most younger and healthy people might do better to go the route of Sweden while obviously our elderly or high risk people would not fare very well.

Herd immunity is natures' vaccine, right? I think to a degree you have to embrace it. To what degree I guess is the question.
[Reply]
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