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Saccopoo Memorial Draft Forum>Cap Space for 2020
The Franchise 03:29 PM 11-12-2019
Here are some cap figures for next year.

Current cap space to be rolled over to 2020 - $21 million
Current cap space projected for 2020 - $1.6 million

People who should be cut after this season. Their replacement in quotes.

Sammy Watkins (Pringle/Hardman) - $14 million cap savings
LDT (Wylie/Rankin) - $5 million cap savings
Daniel Sorenson (literally anybody or Watts) - $3.75 million cap savings
Cameron Erving (literally anybody) - $3.25 million cap savings
Damien Williams (Thompson) - $2.3 million cap savings
Dustin Colquitt (It's a punter...come on) - $1.35 million cap savings

That's 6 cuts that we should have no problem finding a replacement for.

Projected cap space for 2020 after cuts - $31 million

We could add more by making Anthony Hitchens a June 1st cut. That would put his dead cap space in 2020 at
$4.2 million and his cap savings at $8.5 million. It would only save us roughly $2 million in 2021 and then
$11 million in 2022. I think he's overpaid but a decent #2 LB.

So, if we roll over the cap space from this year, and with the 6 cuts, we should be at $52 million in
cap space.

We're obviously going to need that cap space for Mahomes but we will only have 2 CBs under contract
(Ward and Fenton). We also will have 4 DEs under contract (Clark, Okafor, KPass and Speaks). I think
some of that cap space should be to bring Ogbah back if it isn't a huge amount of money.
[Reply]
pugsnotdrugs19 09:46 PM 11-19-2019
I’m very much so down with drafting an IOL pretty early. I don’t think it’d take much to upgrade either.

LB, CB, IOL, RB. Big needs ahead at those spots.
[Reply]
Chris Meck 09:35 PM 11-28-2019
Originally Posted by pugsnotdrugs19:
Iím very much so down with drafting an IOL pretty early. I donít think itíd take much to upgrade either.

LB, CB, IOL, RB. Big needs ahead at those spots.
If we had Indy's offensive line, we'd score 50 a game and nobody would ever touch Mahomes.
[Reply]
RunKC 11:40 AM 12-18-2019
Even though it should happen, it’s hard for me to think Andy will allow Veach to part with Sammy next year, especially if we don’t win it all.

Idk why I just have a feeling Andy is going to try to keep as many weapons as he can and tell Veach to make Pat and Jones (I think Veach will extend him) first year cap hits low.

Frank Clark’s cap hit is $6.5 million this year. I think something similar will be set up for Chris Jones.
[Reply]
pugsnotdrugs19 12:09 PM 12-18-2019
Originally Posted by RunKC:
Even though it should happen, itís hard for me to think Andy will allow Veach to part with Sammy next year, especially if we donít win it all.

Idk why I just have a feeling Andy is going to try to keep as many weapons as he can and tell Veach to make Pat and Jones (I think Veach will extend him) first year cap hits low.

Frank Clarkís cap hit is $6.5 million this year. I think something similar will be set up for Chris Jones.
After 2 years of observation, Iím pretty convinced that the best way to build this team for sustained championship contention is placing top priority on defense and offensive line. Especially moving forward.

If Mahomes has consistently good protection and Hill, Kelce, Hardman. Heís going to make shit happen. One way or another.

But to have a good defense to lean on when times are tough is critical I think.
[Reply]
pugsnotdrugs19 12:15 PM 12-18-2019
Terez reinforced on his pod today that KC wants to do a deal with Jones
[Reply]
DJ's left nut 03:12 PM 12-18-2019
Regarding Jones - there MIGHT be a viable replacement on the market for him from Pittsburgh.

Javon Hargrave is probably one of the best interior defenders that you've never heard of. He's damn good and has only looked better this year with Tuitt being injured. He's gonna make some nice money this year but I believe it will likely be a fraction of what Jones is making.

Now realize that Hargrave is doing this while playing the nastiest position in football - a true NT in Pittsburgh. You get him in a 4-3 and let him play a little freer and you could see an even bigger tick up in production. AND you'd get another damn big body in there.

If it's the sort of move that can save you $5-6 million in AAV over the next few years, I think you have to strongly consider it. Hargrave is under the radar for most people but he can be a true nightmare for opponents.
[Reply]
O.city 03:16 PM 12-18-2019
Originally Posted by DJ's left nut:
Regarding Jones - there MIGHT be a viable replacement on the market for him from Pittsburgh.

Javon Hargrave is probably one of the best interior defenders that you've never heard of. He's damn good and has only looked better this year with Tuitt being injured. He's gonna make some nice money this year but I believe it will likely be a fraction of what Jones is making.

Now realize that Hargrave is doing this while playing the nastiest position in football - a true NT in Pittsburgh. You get him in a 4-3 and let him play a little freer and you could see an even bigger tick up in production. AND you'd get another damn big body in there.

If it's the sort of move that can save you $5-6 million in AAV over the next few years, I think you have to strongly consider it. Hargrave is under the radar for most people but he can be a true nightmare for opponents.
Maybe.

I'm not keen on bringing in an outside free agent to replace a departing one just because of money. There's always that risk of said guy just not fitting here for one reason or another.

I think they've shoehorned themselves into having to move away from Jones, sadly though, so something will have to be done.
[Reply]
pugsnotdrugs19 03:18 PM 12-18-2019
Yeah no thanks on the Hargrave idea for me. He’s an awesome player, but he’s still going to be pretty expensive. If I’m gonna pay someone at the position, it can be the guy who has earned it here in our own building. And is elite.

Otherwise I’d just roll with Nnadi, Saunders, Pennel, etc. and go cheaper at that spot.
[Reply]
O.city 03:22 PM 12-18-2019
Middlekauf had a good segment on his last podcast about paying players. I think I probably agree.

Anyway, he was basically saying he's willing to overpay a guy or pay a premium for him if he has an elite upside. Guys like Prescott that play really well in a system, you just can't do it because they don't have that elite talent upside. Paying Wentz you can stomach because "atleast he has elite upside and if he can hit that, you get your moneys worth"

So with Jones, he's got elite upside. He can be a top 2 or 3 interior defender in football. I would pay for that.
[Reply]
DJ's left nut 03:59 PM 12-18-2019
Originally Posted by O.city:
Middlekauf had a good segment on his last podcast about paying players. I think I probably agree.

Anyway, he was basically saying he's willing to overpay a guy or pay a premium for him if he has an elite upside. Guys like Prescott that play really well in a system, you just can't do it because they don't have that elite talent upside. Paying Wentz you can stomach because "atleast he has elite upside and if he can hit that, you get your moneys worth"

So with Jones, he's got elite upside. He can be a top 2 or 3 interior defender in football. I would pay for that.
Generally speaking I agree - you pay for difference makers; guys with elite skill and ability.

But when you ALSO pay for guys like Okafor and Hitchens or gambles on tools like Watkins fail, then you're left trying to come up with a Plan B. And as far as Plan Bs go, Hargrave could be a hell of a fallback.

The problem is that Hargrave doesn't fit the talent here quite as well in that he's not a guy who's likely to be an asset bouncing out to DE like Jones can if Saunders/Nnadi continue to perform at a high level or excel.
[Reply]
kccrow 07:54 PM 12-18-2019
I'm of the opinion that this draft is strong enough at DT that if you can get a good return on a tag and trade of Jones you do that.

For example, Marvin Wilson would be a baller in this defense in my opinion. Don't know if he'll fall far enough for us to get him, but that's where he's projected right now.
[Reply]
BryanBusby 09:09 PM 12-18-2019
I think this class at IDL is awfully weak.

I like Kinlaw and Brown is stout, but shit it gets thin after they go.
[Reply]
kccrow 09:50 PM 12-18-2019
Originally Posted by BryanBusby:
I think this class at IDL is awfully weak.

I like Kinlaw and Brown is stout, but shit it gets thin after they go.
If Wilson and Lynch declare I don't think so. It's pretty stout in the top 10 DTs.

Davis is solid, then you have Wilson, Lynch, and an already declared Madubuike and Elliott. Murchison, Lawrence, Fotu, offer solid value solid in different ways. Coatney is a sleeper in my opinion.
[Reply]
Chris Meck 09:24 AM 12-19-2019
Originally Posted by O.city:
Maybe.

I'm not keen on bringing in an outside free agent to replace a departing one just because of money. There's always that risk of said guy just not fitting here for one reason or another.

I think they've shoehorned themselves into having to move away from Jones, sadly though, so something will have to be done.
I don't think so.


Some guys will be gone, but I don't think Jones will be one of them.
[Reply]
DJ's left nut 02:06 PM 12-19-2019
Man, just take a look at the FA defensive tackle group....

Jones
Leonard Williams
Jarran Reed
A'Shanwn Robinson
DJ Reader
Jordan Phillips
Michael Pierce
Javon Hargrave
Michael Brockers
Suh
Tyler Davison
Quentin Jefferson
Danny SHelton
Maliek Collins
Nick Williams


Now granted there's a pretty big gap between Jones and someone like Williams, but the question becomes whether or not the depth of FA options holds some value down.

Then again, I think there was some thought that the deep safety group in last year's FA class would hold values down there and all it did was damage the middle-class in the lot. The top of the FA pool still got paid in a big way.

Jones is just awfully unique.
[Reply]
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