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Nzoner's Game Room>***NON-POLITICAL COVID-19 Discussion Thread***
JakeF 10:28 PM 02-26-2020
A couple of reminders...

Originally Posted by Bwana:
Once again, don't come in this thread with some kind of political agenda, or you will be shown the door. If you want to go that route, there is a thread about this in DC.
Originally Posted by Dartgod:
People, there is a lot of good information in this thread, let's try to keep the petty bickering to a minimum.

We all have varying opinions about the impact of this, the numbers, etc. We will all never agree with each other. But we can all keep it civil.

Thanks!

Click here for the original OP:

Spoiler!

[Reply]
htismaqe 02:38 PM 09-01-2020
Originally Posted by suzzer99:
Yeah.

In LA lots of gym owners are defying the order. I haven't seen any bars defying and staying open.
It will be interesting to see how it plays out.

I know when were in Branson recently, there were signs in some businesses that literally said:

"By order of the City of Branson, ordinance blah blah blah, you are REQUIRED to wear a mask inside of this business under penalty of fine of $100" but when you read all the way to the bottom (they were QUITE wordy) said "we understand we have no way to enforce this".

We saw lots of people not wearing masks and nobody hassled them, not business owners, not other patrons, not even the police.
[Reply]
Donger 02:41 PM 09-01-2020
Originally Posted by htismaqe:
It will be interesting to see how it plays out.

I know when were in Branson recently, there were signs in some businesses that literally said:

"By order of the City of Branson, ordinance blah blah blah, you are REQUIRED to wear a mask inside of this business under penalty of fine of $100" but when you read all the way to the bottom (they were QUITE wordy) said "we understand we have no way to enforce this".

We saw lots of people not wearing masks and nobody hassled them, not business owners, not other patrons, not even the police.
Selfish people.
[Reply]
htismaqe 02:43 PM 09-01-2020
Originally Posted by Donger:
Selfish people.
Certainly could be painted that way but that wasn't really my point.

It doesn't seem that a lot of these municipal mandates are enforceable at all. We're going to have to have some kind of legal precedent set, tried in court, or at least some people are just going to ignore the orders.
[Reply]
MahomesMagic 02:48 PM 09-01-2020
Originally Posted by Donger:
A case is an infection, as you just acknowledged. So there's nothing misleading about that either.
No, I never acknowledged that.

A case is a detection of viral particles that may or may not be( 40 to 90% of the time) a viral infection.

The NY Times showed that as many as 90% of cases were not active infections.
[Reply]
Donger 02:51 PM 09-01-2020
Originally Posted by MahomesMagic:
No, I never acknowledged that.

A case is a detection of viral particles that may or may not be( 40 to 90% of the time) a viral infection.

The NY Times showed that as many as 90% of cases were not active infections.
Yes, you did:

Cases are defined however the state wants them to be. Right now that is any positive result from 37 to 40 cycles of the PCR test.

If a person tests positive, they have been infected.

How are the viral particles detected in a person without that person being infected?
[Reply]
O.city 02:54 PM 09-01-2020
Originally Posted by Donger:
Yes, you did:

Cases are defined however the state wants them to be. Right now that is any positive result from 37 to 40 cycles of the PCR test.

If a person tests positive, they have been infected.

How are the viral particles detected in a person without that person being infected?
Have been and being are different. It's not viral particles. It's viral RNA. It could be degraded, it could be viable.

If it's at that specific level, likely, you're seeing the artifacts of a cleared infection.
[Reply]
Donger 02:58 PM 09-01-2020
Originally Posted by O.city:
Have been and being are different. It's not viral particles. It's viral RNA. It could be degraded, it could be viable.

If it's at that specific level, likely, you're seeing the artifacts of a cleared infection.
Yes, I know. And the person only has the artifacts because they were infected with SARS-CoV-2. Hence, they get counted as a case.
[Reply]
O.city 02:58 PM 09-01-2020
If I'm reading it right, the German tests use a 30 ct amplification cycle, where as we're using IIRC 37/40.

I'd imagine that is gonna lead to more positives?
[Reply]
O.city 03:00 PM 09-01-2020
Originally Posted by Donger:
Yes, I know. And the person only has the artifacts because they were infected with SARS-CoV-2. Hence, they get counted as a case.
"were" infected is of no significance to us and the public health response.

So we're wading into active vs artifact and that does no good.
[Reply]
Discuss Thrower 03:03 PM 09-01-2020
Originally Posted by O.city:
"were" infected is of no significance to us and the public health response.

So we're wading into active vs artifact and that does no good.
AGENDA!
[Reply]
Donger 03:05 PM 09-01-2020
Originally Posted by O.city:
"were" infected is of no significance to us and the public health response.

So we're wading into active vs artifact and that does no good.
I don't agree. Knowing total cases is important in trying to determine the prevalence and R0. Cases are counted (as best they can) for every pandemic. Even seasonal influenza.
[Reply]
BigCatDaddy 03:47 PM 09-01-2020
Originally Posted by htismaqe:
It will be interesting to see how it plays out.

I know when were in Branson recently, there were signs in some businesses that literally said:

"By order of the City of Branson, ordinance blah blah blah, you are REQUIRED to wear a mask inside of this business under penalty of fine of $100" but when you read all the way to the bottom (they were QUITE wordy) said "we understand we have no way to enforce this".

We saw lots of people not wearing masks and nobody hassled them, not business owners, not other patrons, not even the police.
CDC guidelines suggest not having employees confront customers regarding mask.
[Reply]
htismaqe 03:54 PM 09-01-2020
Originally Posted by BigCatDaddy:
CDC guidelines suggest not having employees confront customers regarding mask.
You'll notice that I said "not employees, not other customers, not even THE POLICE".

You know, the guys that get paid to enforce the law won't touch it. I saw them walk right by without saying a word.
[Reply]
BigCatDaddy 04:23 PM 09-01-2020
Originally Posted by htismaqe:
You'll notice that I said "not employees, not other customers, not even THE POLICE".

You know, the guys that get paid to enforce the law won't touch it. I saw them walk right by without saying a word.
I train with a lot of officers. They want to part of wearing a mask let alone enforcing any mandates
[Reply]
Kiimo 05:05 PM 09-01-2020
Originally Posted by BigCatDaddy:
I train with a lot of officers. They want to part of wearing a mask let alone enforcing any mandates
They sound pretty stupid
[Reply]
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