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Nzoner's Game Room>***NON-POLITICAL COVID-19 Discussion Thread***
JakeF 10:28 PM 02-26-2020
A couple of reminders...

Originally Posted by Bwana:
Once again, don't come in this thread with some kind of political agenda, or you will be shown the door. If you want to go that route, there is a thread about this in DC.
Originally Posted by Dartgod:
People, there is a lot of good information in this thread, let's try to keep the petty bickering to a minimum.

We all have varying opinions about the impact of this, the numbers, etc. We will all never agree with each other. But we can all keep it civil.

Thanks!

Click here for the original OP:

Spoiler!

[Reply]
TLO 07:32 PM 06-22-2020
Originally Posted by O.city:
New cases were likely higher because of testing issues then. Or atleast it would seem that way
I saw an article on CNN today that said likely 80% of virus cases were likely missed in March, FWIW.
[Reply]
O.city 07:37 PM 06-22-2020
Originally Posted by TLO:
I saw an article on CNN today that said likely 80% of virus cases were likely missed in March, FWIW.
At best we caught one in 10, more likely 1 in 20.

One has to hope that paired with the serology testing and the fact that mild cases don’t seroconvert, were farther along in this than we think
[Reply]
Bearcat 07:37 PM 06-22-2020
Originally Posted by eDave:
I feel like a lot of people like living this way. Those giving me dirty looks for complying with our ordinance are doing nothing to help get us out of this.

Leave aside your opinion on what got us here and help get us out. Because the defiant ones are keeping us down now. And when we get shut down again, to a greater degree, who's going to complain first?

I want my life back but I need help.
Exactly.
[Reply]
O.city 07:39 PM 06-22-2020
https://twitter.com/ballouxfrancois/...660909056?s=21

So you could be missing 53% of cases with serology testing
[Reply]
eDave 07:46 PM 06-22-2020
Originally Posted by Bearcat:
Exactly.
I posted this emotional rant on FB last night.

Dear fellow Phoenix residents,

One of the things I love most about this city is you. But I'm not feeling that right now.

We are screwing up this ordinance without thinking of anyone but ourselves. Our personal
actions now affect countless people and as a result, this ordinance - placed into affect as
we go parabolic and headlining national news due to our casual, outgoing nature - is DOA
after 2 days!!! It's irresponsible, selfish, and embarrassing.

And please stop giving me dirty looks for complying. I know it's out of defiance but I'm doing
this for you and the law as well. I'm going to lose it because the next shutdown is going to be
a lot worse for all of us. We can resume fighting each other later.

Think of your hair if nothing else. That seemed awfully important to everyone last time.

I want my life back. But I need your help.
[Reply]
lewdog 07:55 PM 06-22-2020
Originally Posted by tk13:
We've rang the bell for about a week now, but Texas is heading in the wrong direction. Today their leaders are finally starting to acknowledge it. Starting to lay the groundwork for taking action.

Where's Bleeding Red to tell us about the 28,000 hospital beds in Texas?!?!?
[Reply]
stumppy 08:03 PM 06-22-2020
Originally Posted by lewdog:
Where's Bleeding Red to tell us about the 28,000 hospital beds in Texas?!?!?
He was by earlier with the old 'you should see how many die from heart disease' line.
[Reply]
lewdog 08:04 PM 06-22-2020
Originally Posted by eDave:
I feel like a lot of people like living this way. Those giving me dirty looks for complying with our ordinance are doing nothing to help get us out of this.

Leave aside your opinion on what got us here and help get us out. Because the defiant ones are keeping us down now. And when we get shut down again, to a greater degree, who's going to complain first?

I want my life back but I need help.
Originally Posted by eDave:
I posted this emotional rant on FB last night.

Dear fellow Phoenix residents,

One of the things I love most about this city is you. But I'm not feeling that right now.

We are screwing up this ordinance without thinking of anyone but ourselves. Our personal actions now affect countless people and as a result, this ordinance - placed into affect as we go parabolic and headlining national news due to our casual, outgoing nature - is DOA after 2 days!!! It's irresponsible, selfish, and embarrassing.

And please stop giving me dirty looks for complying. I know it's out of defiance but I'm doing this for you and the law as well. I'm going to lose it because the next shutdown is going to be a lot worse for all of us. We can resume fighting each other later.

Think of your hair if nothing else. That seemed awfully important to everyone last time.

I want my life back. But I need your help.
Best post you've had. Those continuing to chant "freedom" and defy orders in this state will be the ones pushing us into another lockdown. No one wants or needs that. Do your part in mitigation efforts and we can at least maintain some assemble of choices for normal life activities for those wanting to partake.

The mental health factor of this is not lost on me either. It's a very serious feeling to be forced into another lock-down. The first one was hard enough, but a second could be devastating for many. While having a family skews my need for social/entertainment activities during this, those who are single honestly need them. I couldn't imagine how hard a lock-down and working in healthcare through all of this would be without a family to come home to. I didn't mean to rag on you about going out in previous posts, I am just asking you to go out and do it safely, with a mask.

I wish everyone would just take it seriously in this state. We are in big trouble if this is what the end of June is like. I never thought it would be this bad for hospitalizations this far into it here. Banner Good Sam, the biggest hospital in the state has 150 COVID patients. They've opened up 3 additional wings since the start of June to manage all of them. Just this week they also secured out of state nurses to help with staffing issues. It's not just beds, you need staff and equipment or the care sucks!!!
[Reply]
dirk digler 08:20 PM 06-22-2020
Originally Posted by Bearcat:
IMO, it could do without the "bunch of idiots"/"desperation" rhetoric, that stuff makes it all sound just like the worst of the media, which seems to be the opposite of what's intended.
Originally Posted by DaFace:
And biased. Which is fine, but it makes me take everything with a small grain of salt.

I tried to give this guy a chance but then I went back through his twitter feed and he has been saying this was a hoax,fabrication, and data manipulation pretty much from the get go. Also stated numerous times they were withholding test kits for whatever reason. He is a nutter.




[Reply]
displacedinMN 08:36 PM 06-22-2020
This shows how much people suck. Verbally attacking public health officials. Many are walking away.

Originally Posted by :
For Lauri Jones, the trouble began in early May. The director of a small public health department in western Washington State was working with a family under quarantine because of coronavirus exposure. When she heard one family member had been out in the community, Jones decided to check in.

The routine phone call launched a nightmare.

“Someone posted on social media that we had violated their civil liberties [and] named me by name,” Jones recalled. “They said, ‘Let’s post her address … Let’s start shooting.’ “

People from across the country began calling her personal phone with similar threats.

“We’ve be doing the same thing in public health on a daily basis forever. But we are now the villains,” said Jones, 64, who called the police and set up surveillance cameras at her home.

Public health workers, already underfunded and understaffed, are confronting waves of protest at their homes and offices in addition to pressure from politicians who favor a faster reopening. Lori Tremmel Freeman, chief executive of the National Association of County and City Health Officials, said more than 20 health officials have been fired, resigned or have retired in recent weeks “due to conditions related to having to enforce and stand up for strong public health tactics during this pandemic.”


Although shutdown measures are broadly popular, a vocal minority opposes them vociferously. There have been attacks on officials’ race, gender, sexual orientation and appearance. Freeman said some of the criticisms “seem to be harsher for women.”

Marcus Plescia, chief medical officer of the Association of State and Territorial Health Officials, said attacks on health officials have been particularly awful in California, Colorado, Georgia, Ohio and Pennsylvania.

This month in California, Nichole Quick, Orange County’s chief health officer, stepped down after she faced threats and protests at her home for requiring face coverings in many businesses as cases rose. The mandate, issued May 23, was softened to a recommendation a week later.

Andrew Noymer, a professor of public health at the University of California at Irvine who is part of a county task force, said it was not the first time Quick had been undermined.

On March 17, Quick issued a strict lockdown order; a day later it was amended to add exceptions.

“It was couched as a clarification, but it was a walk back,” Noymer said, because of pressure from business leaders.

Quick’s departure is part of an exodus of public health officials across the country who have been blamed by both citizens and politicians for the disruptions caused by the coronavirus pandemic.

“I don’t think I’ve ever seen anybody resign for the kinds of reasons we’ve seen recently,” Plescia said. “We are very concerned that if it continues to get worse it’s going to have major implications for who will be willing to have these jobs.”

Ohio’s public health director, Amy Acton, shifted to an advisory role after enduring months of anger against the state’s preventive measures, including armed protesters at her home bearing messages including anti-Semitic and sexist slurs. One Republican lawmaker linked Acton, who is Jewish, to Nazi Germany; another called her a dictator.

Georgia’s public health director said last month that she receives threats daily and now has an armed escort.

Pennsylvania’s secretary of health, who is transgender, has come under fire for the state’s handling of the pandemic, including from a county official who resigned after saying at a recent meeting that he was “tired of listening to a guy dressed up as a woman.”

Four public health officials in Colorado have left their jobs recently.

A day after telling political leaders in Weld County, Colo., that their insistence on a speedy reopening despite a high case rate and widespread transmission was giving him “serious heartburn,” Public Health Director Mark Wallace got a 7:30 p.m. e-mail: He had until 9 a.m., it said, to weigh in on guidelines for reopening businesses — “churches, salons, restaurants, etc.”They would go public an hour later.

Wallace, who declined to comment for this article, retired soon after.

Theresa Anselmo, executive director of the Colorado Association of Local Public Health Officials, said 80 percent of members had reported being threatened and more than that were at risk of termination or lost funding.

“It’s exhausting to be contradicted and argued with and devalued and demoralized all the time, and I think that’s what you’re seeing around the country,” Anselmo said. “We’ve seen from the top down the federal government is pitting public health against freedom, and to set up that false dichotomy is really a disservice to the men and women who have dedicated their lives … to helping people.”

Not everyone has left willingly. In Colorado’s Rio Grande County, Emily Brown was fired, she says, after advocating a more cautious response to the virus.

“I think I just finally pushed too hard,” she said. “There was resistance to taking steps as quickly as I felt they needed to be taken or move in directions I thought we needed to.”

She had been in her position for six years and valued being part of a close-knit rural community. But during the pandemic, she said, she began getting threatening messages online from people she considered neighbors, including one Facebook post that referenced hanging. She became worried about who she might run into at the grocery store.

“I’ve been surprised at who professes that vitriol so vocally on platforms like social media,” she said.

Derrick Neal, who runs the public health department in Round Rock, Texas, and is past president of the state public health workers’ association, said given the virus’s impact on daily life, public health was inevitably tied up in politics. “But a community has to be healthy in order to be economically solvent,” he said. “That’s been lost in the politics of all this.”

Public health workers in California have also been battered publicly by business groups, ordinary citizens and elected officials. Several have resigned.

“Half a dozen county health leaders are leaving their positions in the coming weeks. All of them have served with distinction and in the interest of public health,” California Medical Association president Peter Bretan Jr. said in a statement. “We are deeply concerned that politics may be trumping public interest.”

After Los Angeles County health official Barbara Ferrer held a news conference on May 13 saying some stay-at-home restrictions may remain in place for three more months, a doctored photo of her with dark circles under her eyes made its way across social media. One tweet, liked or retweeted more than 100,000 times, called her “the most unhealthy looking person I have ever seen.”

In a full-page ad in the local newspaper, a business council accused Santa Clara County’s public health officer, Sara Cody, of “cratering our economy” for being the first in the nation to impose a shelter-in-place order. The local sheriff is now investigating threats against her.

People in the field worry that many of these vacant positions will be difficult to fill.

“This is the beginning of a wave of people leaving,” Anselmo said. “Who would want to go work as a director in a public health department when you have a target on your back?”

[Reply]
tk13 08:40 PM 06-22-2020
That's the world we live in now. It's pretty clear that dude is not using facts to come to a hypothesis. Sure looks like he's the type to come up with a hypothesis and then find the facts to support it. People have been doing that for months.

It's not possible that experts who've spent their lives studying this could see the storm coming over the hill to declare an emergency. No, it's a conspiracy involving every medical expert, doctor and nurse, in conjunction with every Republican and Democrat governor and public health official in 50 different states... plus the equivalent officials in about 100 other countries in the world.
[Reply]
Chief Pagan 08:57 PM 06-22-2020
Guns, germs, steel, and internet trolls.
[Reply]
BigCatDaddy 09:13 PM 06-22-2020
Originally Posted by displacedinMN:
This shows how much people suck. Verbally attacking public health officials. Many are walking away.
Sounds a lot like another profession right now.
[Reply]
BigCatDaddy 09:14 PM 06-22-2020
Anybody disputing his facts yet? So far all I see is people complaining about motive and him saying mean things.
[Reply]
stumppy 09:26 PM 06-22-2020
Originally Posted by BigCatDaddy:
Anybody disputing his facts yet? So far all I see is people complaining about motive and him saying mean things.
Looks like the kind of guy you're anxious to believe. Let's face it, when you call yourself "Ethical Skeptic' it's about like someone calling themselves a stable genus.
So yea, you should build yourself a little soap box out of his info and post away.


The results should be hilarious.
[Reply]
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