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View Poll Results: In this scenario what would you do as a parent?
Get the abortion? 7 20.00%
Try to carry the baby to term? 21 60.00%
If yes on 1, Get it at week 12 before confirmation 4 11.43%
If yes on 1, Get it at week 16 amnio only confirmation 4 11.43%
If yes on 1, Get it week 17 to 22 with 100% confirmation 3 8.57%
Multiple Choice Poll. Voters: 35. You may not vote on this poll
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Washington DC and The Holy Land>Real Talk: Abortion For or Against
Nirvana58 09:38 AM 07-08-2020
You just went to the doctor and found out you and your wife are 12 weeks along with a baby boy. However, they ran an NIPT blood test and say that you are 84% likely that the baby you are having has Edwards Syndrome.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Edwards_syndrome

If you don't know what that is I linked the wiki page. Summary is this is basically the worst disease imaginable that I can think of. The average life span of children born with this is 3 to 14 days. Most babies are born still born if they even make it that far. It is even worst for male children who it seems to effect even more severely. Basically this is every parents worst nightmare.

The doctors can't 100% confirm until you receive an amnio and ultra sounds. This can be around 17 to 20 weeks along in your pregnancy. Even for a rush screening with amnio only you won't be able to get the results and make a decision on the abortion till 16 weeks if your lucky.

You can get a CVS earlier but doctors pretty much retired that for the NIPT test that you already received.

No matter your stance on abortion what do you do in this scenario? I am asking you to put yourself in the parents shoes and state your answer. This is not some hypothetical. People have to make this choice every year.

I have 2 questions for you. I will try to link the poll but never done one so we will see what happens.

Do you get an abortion or take it to delivery which most likely will be a still born or have an average life span of 3 to 14 days?

If you do decide to get an abortion when do you do it? The longer you wait the less humane it is but can you abort a child without 100% certainty it has this disease?

You can explain your reasoning or any questions in the replies.
[Reply]
tyecopeland 02:59 PM 07-08-2020
I would defer to the potential mother as she would be the one dealing with the uncomfortableness, normal pregnancy annoyances and possible complications for a pregnancy likely to end in a negative result.

That said I would lean toward keeping through term. But with the odds what they are I wouldn't argue against an abortion.
[Reply]
Nirvana58 03:11 PM 07-08-2020
Originally Posted by tyecopeland:
I would defer to the potential mother as she would be the one dealing with the uncomfortableness, normal pregnancy annoyances and possible complications for a pregnancy likely to end in a negative result.

That said I would lean toward keeping through term. But with the odds what they are I wouldn't argue against an abortion.
The main issue I have is there is no chance of a semi normal life. The condition is so severe that you have a child born to pain.

Leaving out the emotional and financial toll this will take on the parents. Say they have other kids to worry about and both work full time living pay check to pay check? How do you even try to deal with this?

I left that out of the original question but this is real life scenarios. The thought of having to make this kind of choice can shake you to your core.
[Reply]
El Lobo Gordo 03:51 PM 07-08-2020
Originally Posted by Nirvana58:
The main issue I have is there is no chance of a semi normal life. The condition is so severe that you have a child born to pain.

Leaving out the emotional and financial toll this will take on the parents. Say they have other kids to worry about and both work full time living pay check to pay check? How do you even try to deal with this?

I left that out of the original question but this is real life scenarios. The thought of having to make this kind of choice can shake you to your core.
If you get a choice, you aren't killing the unborn child because you have too but because you want too.
[Reply]
Nirvana58 04:01 PM 07-08-2020
Originally Posted by El Lobo Gordo:
If you get a choice, you aren't killing the unborn child because you have too but because you want too.
You have to make a choice no matter what. Doing nothing is a choice.

Trying to spare a child pain and believing you are making the humane choice isn't because you want too.

If it was up to the parent they would want their kid to be a healthy. This is trying to make a life altering decision (for all parties) when there is no good options.
[Reply]
Randallflagg 04:06 PM 07-08-2020
Originally Posted by Nirvana58:
You have to make a choice no matter what. Doing nothing is a choice.

Trying to spare a child pain and believing you are making the humane choice isn't because you want too.

If it was up to the parent they would want their kid to be a healthy. This is trying to make a life altering decision (for all parties) when there is no good options.

How long before we begin to abort the "old"? I only ask because I am quite old...and quite frankly, everyday is painful for me. Some days I would rather stay in bed - but I get my ass up and live.

I can see a time in the future where, old people are looked at as the fetus (baby) is.
[Reply]
Nirvana58 04:16 PM 07-08-2020
Originally Posted by Randallflagg:
How long before we begin to abort the "old"? I only ask because I am quite old...and quite frankly, everyday is painful for me. Some days I would rather stay in bed - but I get my ass up and live.

I can see a time in the future where, old people are looked at as the fetus (baby) is.
This is definitely trying to move the goal post or pivot the conversation. I can guess you have enjoyed a long life with probably plenty of ups and downs.

A child born to nothing but pain and misery with no capabilities of living the life you were blessed to have. Should not even be put in the same conversation of normal pains of growing old.
[Reply]
Just Passin' By 04:22 PM 07-08-2020
Originally Posted by Nirvana58:
This is definitely trying to move the goal post or pivot the conversation. I can guess you have enjoyed a long life with probably plenty of ups and downs.

A child born to nothing but pain and misery with no capabilities of living the life you were blessed to have. Should not even be put in the same conversation of normal pains of growing old.
The underlying question is the same:

When should society be allowed to determine that a life, or potential life, is not worth protecting, and should be ended, or at least allowed to be ended, without the consent of the potential subject?
[Reply]
El Lobo Gordo 04:26 PM 07-08-2020
Originally Posted by Nirvana58:
You have to make a choice no matter what. Doing nothing is a choice.

Trying to spare a child pain and believing you are making the humane choice isn't because you want too.

If it was up to the parent they would want their kid to be a healthy. This is trying to make a life altering decision (for all parties) when there is no good options.
Lets not gaslight the situation.

A mother who chooses to abort here chooses to abort because:

1. She doesn't want her baby to needlessly suffer.
2. She doesn't want to bare the emotional pain herself.
3. She doesn't want to bare the financial pain.

She would rather have a healthy baby. That isn't an option. She chooses to abort to fulfill a lot of her own wants.
[Reply]
Randallflagg 04:40 PM 07-08-2020
Originally Posted by Nirvana58:
This is definitely trying to move the goal post or pivot the conversation. I can guess you have enjoyed a long life with probably plenty of ups and downs.

A child born to nothing but pain and misery with no capabilities of living the life you were blessed to have. Should not even be put in the same conversation of normal pains of growing old.


And tell me....who is going to decide what is quality of life and who should forfeit their child?

I understand your OP. However, 58 million dead babies (I would assert) that the large majority of that number have been sacrificed for noting more than the sake of "convenience".
[Reply]
El Lobo Gordo 04:41 PM 07-08-2020
Originally Posted by Randallflagg:
How long before we begin to abort the "old"? I only ask because I am quite old...and quite frankly, everyday is painful for me. Some days I would rather stay in bed - but I get my ass up and live.

I can see a time in the future where, old people are looked at as the fetus (baby) is.
Don't worry old timer, we'll put you down because:

1. We don't want to see you suffer needlessly.
2. We don't want to bare the emotional pain.
3. We don't want to bare the financial pain.

We'd rather have a healthy Randallflagg That isn't an option. Were going to put you down to fulfill a lot of our own wants.
[Reply]
Randallflagg 04:47 PM 07-08-2020
Originally Posted by El Lobo Gordo:
Don't worry old timer, we'll put you down because:

1. We don't want to see you suffer needlessly.
2. We don't want to bare the emotional pain.
3. We don't want to bare the financial pain.

We'd rather have a healthy Randallflagg That isn't an option. Were going to put you down to fulfill a lot of our own wants.

Well certainly. I'm an "inconvenience" at my age :-)

So, what is the difference between the very old and the unborn? We are (apparently) in the way......... 58 million and counting every day. Jesus Weeps.
[Reply]
Nirvana58 04:51 PM 07-08-2020
Originally Posted by El Lobo Gordo:
Lets not gaslight the situation.

A mother who chooses to abort here chooses to abort because:

1. She doesn't want her baby to needlessly suffer.
2. She doesn't want to bare the emotional pain herself.
3. She doesn't want to bare the financial pain.

She would rather have a healthy baby. That isn't an option. She chooses to abort to fulfill a lot of her own wants.
By that logic.

1. She lets her baby suffer because she doesn't want to make a hard choice.
2. She lets her baby suffer because she doesn't want to go against her religious beliefs.
3. She lets her baby suffer because she doesn't want to take another life.
[Reply]
Nirvana58 04:53 PM 07-08-2020
Originally Posted by Randallflagg:
And tell me....who is going to decide what is quality of life and who should forfeit their child?

I understand your OP. However, 58 million dead babies (I would assert) that the large majority of that number have been sacrificed for noting more than the sake of "convenience".
I know based on the title it might be misleading. However, I am just asking for this specific scenario. I am actually against abortions and the thought of it makes me sick to my stomach.

This is a real life scenario that people have to go through. Just trying to have everyone walk a mile in their shoes type of situation and try to make a guess on what they would do.
[Reply]
Nirvana58 04:58 PM 07-08-2020
Originally Posted by Just Passin' By:
The underlying question is the same:

When should society be allowed to determine that a life, or potential life, is not worth protecting, and should be ended, or at least allowed to be ended, without the consent of the potential subject?
Which is a pivot. Because in this situation the baby will never have the ability to consent. Even if you spent millions of dollars keeping them alive with the best care. The beat all odds and by a miracle to live past there first year. The will never have the cognitive abilities to understand this conversation.

If people want to talk about assisted suicides for the terminal or the old. That is definitely an interest conversation but doesn't apply here.
[Reply]
stevieray 04:59 PM 07-08-2020
Ghoulish thread where you have to make up a scenario to justify murder for your own nobility.
[Reply]
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