We, the NFL, condemn racism and the systematic oppression of Black People. We, the NFL, admit we were wrong for not listening to NFL players earlier and encourage all to speak out and peacefully protest. We, the NFL, believe Black Lives Matter. #InspireChangepic.twitter.com/ENWQP8A0sv
Originally Posted by DJ's left nut:
Now you're shifting the goalposts.
What do broken window policing and stop and frisk have to do with incarceration rates? Broken window policing may take it up a tick but folks are also ignoring that incarceration hasn't gone down when the preferred model has flipped over the years to the community policing model. If it drives it, it's by a de minimis amount that isn't showing in the numbers.
Complicated answer. Lots of community policing models aren't true community policing. They may have more officers on the ground but they still arrest everyone for everything. And even still, community policing isn't necessarily THE answer. It's just one possible solution.
Originally Posted by :
Moreover, if the overwhelming majority of first time possession offenders don't spend time in prison for the offense (not when they're at misdemeanor levels), how are they going to 'criminal training 101' and then being driven into recidivism? They got off with a fine and maybe an ankle bracelet and went back and did it again, so why should I blame prison for their recidivism OR assume that others who are imprisoned wouldn't have additional offenses had they NOT gone to prison?
Prison has something like 45% recidivism. That's really really lousy. So anyone who goes to prison has a really good chance of going back to crime once released. Plus juvy. It's like a training ground for ordinary people to become experts at becoming a lifelong criminal. It's estimated that ~40% of prisoners are serving time for nonviolent crimes. So the question is plenty relevant... could many of these crimes have found a punishment route besides prison. A route that would have done better than 45% at recidivism? That's not a high bar to cross.
Originally Posted by :
Besides, at a point incarceration doesn't exist for your benefit but rather for the benefit of the public. If you just won't stop using illegal drugs, we're going to remove you from the population for a bit to at least expose fewer people to you. You've gotten your shot across the bow and you're still breaking the law - time to try something else or at least cull you from the public for a minute or two.
Does it? Has the explosion in incarceration correlated with an explosive increase in public safety? Or are we incarcerating people en masse for the fuzzy feel good feeling that more arrests means "tough on crime." Because we hold a MUCH higher punitive standard than many other free world countries. We throw the book at wrongdoers where other countries might instead seek a fine or diversion program instead. If prisons and juvy are failing to reform prisoners, then any time we blindly throw prisoners into these places we are basically building a criminal pipeline. Isn't it possible that many of these low level offenders might reform to good behavior if they go through a prison alternative? Can't be hard to beat 45%. [Reply]
Originally Posted by mr. tegu:
What they really want is the real world to reflect the fantasy world they’ve created on their social media over the years in which anything that hurts their feelings is silenced and removed from their radar and they don’t have to actually think critically about anything or communicate with people of differing opinions.
This is literally the internet though. It isn't in any way contained to younger people. Just go spend 5 minutes in DC. You will find literally dozens of mature adults who have spent way too long listening to viewpoints and news sources that only align with their worldview and are now completely disassociated with reality.
Heck, you don't even have to go to DC. Go spend 5 minutes in the COVID thread. It's full of people who are only looking for facts that support the reality they want to exist. [Reply]
Originally Posted by staylor26:
You are such a butt****ing moron it’s unbelievable.
When the **** did DJ or I say that it’s not ok for people to protest? You’ve literally gotten something wrong every single time you’ve posted in this thread about me.
I didn’t like Kaep because he wore a Castro shirt and defended the man who tried to have my grandfather killed and is basically Hitler for my people. It has nothing to do with kneeling moron. I had no problem with that and still don’t.
Also, I brought up Chicago and unwed mothers once dipshit.
Edit: This is a Billay mult 100% and you’re trolling though. I’ve figured it out. Only Billay gets every single thing wrong like you do.
Not a mult. Just one of many who've seen your garbage posts throughout this thread. I'm not surprised b/c I've read your garbage posts about other topics but you've managed to outdo your own retardary. You've brought up Chicago once? You mean once per day fuckstick? Please, as soon this thread finally gets back on track here you come talking about Chicago, or unwed this or black on black that. I'll look forward to your garbage, deflecting return from this one.
P.S: This kneeling isn't gonna be only a NFL thing. There's a good chance it the ncaa kids do it too. Including your hurricanes. [Reply]
Originally Posted by mkp785:
Not a mult. Just one of many who've seen your garbage posts throughout this thread. I'm not surprised b/c I've read your garbage posts about other topics but you've managed to outdo your own retardary. You've brought up Chicago once? You mean once per day fuckstick? Please, as soon this thread finally gets back on track here you come talking about Chicago, or unwed this or black on black that. I'll look forward to your garbage, deflecting return from this one.
P.S: This kneeling isn't gonna be only a NFL thing. There's a good chance it the ncaa kids do it too. Including your hurricanes.
Originally Posted by KS Smitty:
I have spent the last 4 months working with 18-32 year olds from different locations, backgrounds and ethnicities and you are way off the mark. I also have 28 and 35 year old children as well as nieces and nephews in that age range. These "kids" are well informed due to social media, it's not all stupid drama and videos they are sharing information, checking their sources (none of them trust the media) and willing to have open civil discourse on current events. I have 2 police officers in my family, one took his oath this month and a niece active in KUBridge in Lawrence. They are quite capable of being the ones to affect major change in this world.
I've brought this up several times in the last few years. I’m really hopeful for the future. I think they may End up being the best generation since the greatest generation.
My son is a millilienial. I’ve seen his friends interact all the time. They are with it. Well informed. They are disappointed with the two party system, what we gave them. Can’t say I blame them. They are the future whether we like it or not. Maybe let them run with this and see how they fix the core issues. [Reply]
Originally Posted by Chief Roundup:
Where does all this stuff stop? It is so damn ridiculous. The University should tell them NO and go play or we are cutting your scholarships.
The French Revolution started out with the majority population of the nation getting pissed that they didn't have enough say in the government. And eventually it led to them trying to implement fucking weird shit like decimalizing time. And along the way, hundreds of leaders from the early days of the revolution were guillotined during the terror because they didn't evolve quickly enough in the way of change and turned into an opposition that had to be dealt with.
That's what makes a revolution a revolution. A societal problem keeps building up pressure in a powder keg, a singular event or compacted set of decisions ignites it, and eventually as momentum builds, the extremists continue to occupy the power vacuum when entities are removed or changed. It's a snowball effect, and it stops only when things get too fucking unstable and it collapses in on itself.
We're going through a mini-revolution right now. It will keep progressing. I don't think we're going to be guillotining anybody any time soon, but ya never know. [Reply]
Originally Posted by RealSNR:
The French Revolution started out with the majority population of the nation getting pissed that they didn't have enough say in the government. And eventually it led to them trying to implement ****ing weird shit like decimalizing time. And along the way, hundreds of leaders from the early days of the revolution were guillotined during the terror because they didn't evolve quickly enough in the way of change and turned into an opposition that had to be dealt with.
That's what makes a revolution a revolution. A societal problem keeps building up pressure in a powder keg, a singular event or compacted set of decisions ignites it, and eventually as momentum builds, the extremists continue to occupy the power vacuum when entities are removed or changed. It's a snowball effect, and it stops only when things get too ****ing unstable and it collapses in on itself.
We're going through a mini-revolution right now. It will keep progressing. I don't think we're going to be guillotining anybody any time soon, but ya never know.
its an easy issue. Most young people don’t give a shit about a persons skin color. Don’t understand why we tolerate a different treatment for people of color.
But, my peeps of here with right leaning views, take a breath, your views will be represented in this new generation. You may see the extreme left on TV but my experience is that some are for gun rights, curtailing immigration, strong borders etc. [Reply]
Originally Posted by mr. tegu:
This is completely different. If you are twenty years old or so (and even up to the thirties) and of the mindset so many are, your life is built almost entirely on social media. Your entire identity, your interests, your sources of self-esteem, anxiety, stress and happiness, your friends, the information you take in, everything comes from your interactions on social media and the internet.
They can actively manipulate their entire existence into a comfortable and easy “reality” in a way never before possible. It’s not healthy in any way shape or form. It’s not surprising they have extreme anxiety and stress towards anything that confronts their false reality. The response is to immediately demand action, always from others mind you, to resolve their own internal struggles for them.
They haven’t learned to deal with their emotions. They only learn to cut off anything that is unpleasant so when they encounter something that they can’t simply remove like it’s something on their social media feed, they do the only thing they know to do in order to reconcile their emotions, which is demand someone else cut out the source of their uncomfortable feelings.
Originally Posted by mr. tegu:
This is completely different. If you are twenty years old or so (and even up to the thirties) and of the mindset so many are, your life is built almost entirely on social media. Your entire identity, your interests, your sources of self-esteem, anxiety, stress and happiness, your friends, the information you take in, everything comes from your interactions on social media and the internet.
They can actively manipulate their entire existence into a comfortable and easy “reality” in a way never before possible. It’s not healthy in any way shape or form. It’s not surprising they have extreme anxiety and stress towards anything that confronts their false reality. The response is to immediately demand action, always from others mind you, to resolve their own internal struggles for them.
They haven’t learned to deal with their emotions. They only learn to cut off anything that is unpleasant so when they encounter something that they can’t simply remove like it’s something on their social media feed, they do the only thing they know to do in order to reconcile their emotions, which is demand someone else cut out the source of their uncomfortable feelings.
What you say makes a lot of sense...
It's the same kind of sense that says violent video games causes people to be violent. And yet, the reality of the situation is that they DON'T make people more violent.
Society changes. It changes REALLY FAST these days. And it's kind of remarkable that for every new innovation that comes along ("We're raising a generation of TV-addicted zombies!" -1970-90) the generation that is supposedly fucked up by being raised on the new innovation winds up being just fine in the end.
Frankly, I disagree with your assessment because it's nothing more than speculation and presumed correlation without any real evidence to back it up. [Reply]
Originally Posted by RealSNR:
The French Revolution started out with the majority population of the nation getting pissed that they didn't have enough say in the government. And eventually it led to them trying to implement ****ing weird shit like decimalizing time. And along the way, hundreds of leaders from the early days of the revolution were guillotined during the terror because they didn't evolve quickly enough in the way of change and turned into an opposition that had to be dealt with.
That's what makes a revolution a revolution. A societal problem keeps building up pressure in a powder keg, a singular event or compacted set of decisions ignites it, and eventually as momentum builds, the extremists continue to occupy the power vacuum when entities are removed or changed. It's a snowball effect, and it stops only when things get too ****ing unstable and it collapses in on itself.
We're going through a mini-revolution right now. It will keep progressing. I don't think we're going to be guillotining anybody any time soon, but ya never know.
Having 40 million people out of work and with no entertainment options has legitimately been factors that fueled revolutionary activity before, too. There’s a reason people are asking NBA players to postpone the playoffs out of fear it will break the protest movement.
The jobs situation and society being at a halt were two major factors at the onset of this movement. [Reply]
Originally Posted by BigRedChief:
its an easy issue. Most young people don’t give a shit about a persons skin color. Don’t understand why we tolerate a different treatment for people of color.
But, my peeps of here with right leaning views, take a breath, your views will be represented in this new generation. You may see the extreme left on TV but my experience is that some are for gun rights, curtailing immigration, strong borders etc.
Originally Posted by Chiefspants:
Yep. I think we’re kind of witnessing what happens when a young group of workers realizes the power of their platform and demands change from that platform. I teach Gen Z. They grew up in the midst of a recession and a nation that’s been at war for 100% of their lives. Every class YouTube video I show they like, dislike and/or comment on it. They grew up knowing how connected they are to the platforms they use and how to use those platforms. People got annoyed by my generation (Gen Y) but folks, my generation at least tried to go about the regular/pre-established avenues for change. These kids have grown up in a system that has been in constant warfare and economic insecurity. Not only that, but job opportunities, university opportunities, and even their health care (in the district I teach in) is going away. My Gen Z students feel like they have zero reason to trust the system whatsoever. If ya’ll thought Gen Y was impatient and loud - look out - you ain’t seen nothing yet.
FTR, I know there’s been a lot of Gen Y/Gen Z overlap in these protests - but I’d argue we’re seeing a lot of the demands come from Gen Z. Gen Y solutions (registering to vote, reform, etc) are not moving the needle right now.
Also feels like their parents were constantly screwed over by companies or (and I know this is broad) "the system" so older folks clutch their pearls about Y and Z's lack of loyalty to institutions but they have seen all that loyalty get discarded casually so why play the game?
I cringe at a lot of lazy descriptions of young people because they are just that but I have noticed one thing. Gen Z has some problems with in person conflict resolution....even the small stuff. Being so connected that its just a natural function has empowered them in so many ways but in person communication seems to come harder. [Reply]
Originally Posted by :
Nonviolent civil-rights activists were often met with police and posse violence. Black Americans were subjected to beatings, lynchings, bombings, and shootings that rarely resulted in justice for the victims. Images of peaceful black protesters in the clutches of heaving German shepherds, clubbed by uniformed police, and shielding one another from water-cannon blasts are seared into the American psyche.
The lessons of this history have been painfully clear to each successive generation of black Americans: Policing by agents of the state as well as by private citizens is accompanied by an ever-present risk of violence, perpetrators of the violence often go unpunished, and black citizens’ accounts of the violence are often tossed aside. Altogether, even as the nation made lasting strides in extending the rights and privileges of citizenship to black Americans, the inability to receive justice when wronged by agents of the state or other citizens was a right that remained out of their reach.
So, when Ahmaud Arbery is accosted by murderous vigilantes while jogging through his neighborhood, black America is reminded of teenager Trayvon Martin’s killing by an overzealous neighborhood watchman, and of the 1955 lynching of 14-year-old Emmett Till. And when George Floyd dies as a police officer kneels on his neck, black America is reminded of stories of similarly brutal policing over the years: policemen blinding Isaac Woodard in an alleyway, choking out Eric Garner on a street on Staten Island, shooting Walter Scott in the back in an empty North Charleston lot, and the list goes on.
The narrative that emerges from this history is not the result of forced connections between unrelated dots scattered in time and space. Rather, the collection of incidents manifests as a clear articulation of the longstanding deleterious relationship between the state and its black citizens. The relationship is characterized by mistrust, conflict, and the sense that law enforcement is free of oversight and consequence when engaging black citizens. This conception is in the ether — few black Americans can remember the exact day it dawned on them that policing is likely going to be different for them than for most of their fellow citizens.
It is interesting reading about all of these issues on Chiefs Planet went you do so knowing you are looking right into deep red far right POV. Then you wade into DC and its basically Storm Front or OANN.
The broad change of views and perceptions and the conversations people are having have been pretty incredible. Groups of people I would have never guessed in a million years would be contemplating some of this stuff are talking about it on the daily.
Time will tell how much this all really takes hold. While there is a lot of "performative" activism but it also feels like some very fundamental things are going to change going forward. [Reply]
