I don't think it's a gotcha. But it makes no sense to predict someone to breakout then call other people idiots when they're asking why he didn't breakout or if he's good enough to count on in the future.

He got more opportunity this year with 19 more targets and 13 more catches. And with that he only got 22 more yards and 2 less receiving touchdowns. So no, him not being as productive is not a result of him being with Hill and Kelce or them going off this year. He just wasn't as good or efficient as he was last year.
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I’m not calling you an idiot because you’re asking a question you disingenuous fuck.

I’m calling you an idiot because you continue to imply that Hardman is a bust.

Hardman was ridiculously efficient last year. To expect him to maintain that level of efficiency is ridiculous. AJ Brown hasn’t been as efficient as he was last year either, but you can still see his development as a player.

Now Hardman hasn’t quite developed as much as you’d expect in a normal offseason, but this wasn’t a normal offseason or season for that matter. He was also somebody that got COVID during the season. But anybody that has watched closely can see that he is still developing and his route tree has expanded, which is a good sign for year 3 with a normal offseason and Watkins/Robinson out of the way.

You can’t draft day 1 fucking studs in every round. For every Metcalf, there are two guys like Parris Campbell and Areca-Whiteside. Have you looked at the rest of the 2nd round after Hardman? He’s arguably a top 3 player in that group. That’s why I’m calling you an idiot, and it’s well deserved. You have no fucking clue about the draft and talent evaluation. You just put on your captain hindsight hat and play contrarian. You’re fucking clueless.
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Hardman's turnovers have been backbreakers. We just can't afford for him to do this stupid shit in the playoffs.
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When did I imply he's a bust? I'm implying that he fell short of expectations we had and I bet of what the team had. Why's that do hard for you to comprehend? There's a middle area between star and bust you know? Hardman is squarely in that area right now. And that's why people feel the need to get another WR in FA or the draft to start opposite Hill.

And the regular season. How's not having an off-season/covid really an excuse? He couldn't get better during the season? What could have happened differently if he had a normal off season vs the off season he had this year?
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You’ve been implying it on and off all season every time you come into this thread to bitch about him. Why else would to be so “disappointed” in a 2nd round pick? Your disappointment itself and constant voicing of it implies it dude. Just like the last argument we had, you say one thing, but your actions say another. I’m not fucking stupid and I comprehend just fine, just not falling for your shit.

“Im not calling him a total bust”

If you didn’t think he was a bust, you would’ve just said “I’m not calling him a bust”. That was just your way of dodging the fact that he’s been worlds better than those other WR’s I mentioned and far from one. If I’m wrong, then what are we even arguing about? The fact that we didn’t take Metcalf?

If he’s not a bust, there’s not a lot to bitch about right? At least not enough to bitch several times throughout his sophomore season.

As for your 2nd part, it’s so fucking stupid and ignorant that I’m just going to leave it at that.

Of course this wasn’t an ideal offseason for young guys that are still developing. How’s that even debatable? They missed a more time working together and with the coaches than they normally would have. They also missed an entire preseason. It’s not an excuse. Just an observation. The biggest factor for Hardman has always been the lack of opportunity with all the vets in front of him. Reid is a continuity guy through and through. That will all change next year and he will likely have a more normal offseason too. That’s all I was saying.
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Really? When did that happen? I only recall one loss this season, and I'm certain it had nothing to do with Mecole.
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Being disappointed in a player doesn't make that player a bust :-). It just means they haven't lived up to expectations.

And you think the 1 or 2 weeks of OTAs that Mecole missed was the difference between him having a breakout season or not? :-)

You seem to have a problem with people talking about his development. I dunno, maybe stay out of the "What's up with Mecole Hardman?" thread if there's so many dumbasses in it.
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A draft pick not meeting expectations, particularly to a point of frustration, is the definition a bust. Maybe the problem here is your expectations? Again, have you looked at the list of guys taken after Hardman in the 2nd? No, because you don’t have a fucking clue and don’t even follow the draft like that. If you did, you’d understand there’s nothing to be so disappointed about.

People like you bitch that he’s not Metcalf, the big prize, while I’m just happy he’s not Campbell or Arcega-Whiteside who are the epitome of disappointments/busts. We can’t get the big prize of every round. It’s not realistic to expect that. You’re like the people who bitched about Fisher and unrealistically pointed to Hopkins as what we could’ve had, while ignoring the fact that we also could’ve had Luke fucking Joeckel.

You might not be saying he’s definitively a bust yet, but what I mean is you’re implying that he’s trending in that direction. Again, why else would you be bitching? That’s why I’m calling you an idiot. He’s already not a bust at the very least, and he still has a very high ceiling.

It’s not just about OTA’s dude. Guys weren’t allowed to get together like they normally do. I know they tried their best, but they obviously didn’t get the work together that they normally would. But again, you’re still missing the overall point entirely in favor of being a contrarian cunt. It’s about him having a more normal offseason without Watkins and Robinson going into a big year 3 for him.
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Hardman was a raw talent when we drafted him. He's doing fine.
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Hardman has looked pretty impressive at times, maybe inconsistent but nowhere near a bust or even a disappointment. I’m pretty sure the Patriots would jump at the chance to swap Hardman for their 1st round bust N’Keal Harry. Metcalf or Terry McClaurin look like better picks if you had a crystal ball, but, if that was the case, no way Mahomes is a Chief.
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Wtf no it's not :-). A bust is a legitimately bad player.

Those guys have nothing to do with my expectations for him. That's just weird. Just because he's outplayed bad players drafted after him doesn't mean he's met expectations. That doesn't even make sense.

I don't think I've even mentioned Metcalf. You're the one talking about all these other players for whatever reason.

He still got to workout like normal and I'm sure trained with the guys. Maybe not as much as usual but he still did it. And he had a full training camp too. A few OTAs and a few workouts missed wasn't the difference between breakout season and him not doing what we hoped he'd do.

Hell from the workout clips he would post, you were sure he'd have a big year. Now suddenly you're using him not being able to workout like usual as an excuse. You're a contrarian to yourself :-)
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JFC King I’m talking about other players because that’s how the draft fucking works.

You see, there are a pool of players and you have to take the best one for your team/scheme and needs at each pick. If my guy was one of the top 3 drafted in the bottom half of the 2nd round, there’s really not a lot to be disappointed about unless it’s that I didn’t get the big prize. Especially when that guy is still learning how to play a relatively new position while being productive, another point you continue to ignore.

What better way is there to objectively measure a draft pick then putting them against the other options that you had?

And yes, if you’re overly disappointed about Hardman, your expectations are too high for mid 2nd round picks. Maybe pay more attention to the draft and learn how difficult it is just to not draft complete busts after the 1st and your expectations will be more in line with reality.
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Also, I’m clearly talking about him working with his teammates and/or coaches and you bring up private workouts?

That has nothing to do with working together and getting timing/rhythm down which is obviously valuable to his development. You asked what the difference was between this offseason and others. I was just answering your question, now you’re trying to twist it as if that wasn’t the point to begin with.

When did I ever post a video of him working out or comment on it? I don’t even remember doing that. I might’ve said his route running looked better, and it clearly is. So what’s the point?
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My expectations for Hardman was this year were:

Improve your route tree beyond deep routes
Be a reliable 4th option after Hill Kelce, and Watkins

When Sammy is hurt like he always is, be the player that steps up to the #2 spot

Make it so that when Sammy recovers, it's kind of a controversial move amongst fans to put him back in the #2 spot

Separate yourself clearly from DeMarcus Robinson and the rest of the WRs


I will say I did see a few more routes from Hardman in a few games so that was good to see. But other than that, meh. I mean seriously, was expecting him to come in and play the #2 role when Sammy got hurt really that far fetched? The whole "he's not the same type of WR as Sammy Watkins" argument seems like a dumb excuse IMO.
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Don’t underestimate the fucked up offseasons effect. Particularly on young players. Hell Hill and Mahomes weren’t on the same page some this year.

Dilfer (I know, but occasionally he has some good insight) was talking on Russillos podcast that when these dudes do walkthroughs and 7 on 7 and shit they’re gaming out adjustments. What they think they’ll do in a game. How to communicate it etc. and that shit happens in OTA and TC.

Hardman had a LONG way to go from Georgia. I have no doubt the offseason stymied his growth.

Plus a lot of the big ass completions he had last year were long developing routes that we’d fist teams with when they’d roll safeties over to Hill. I imagine those would still be there if the line could hold up.

Hardman isn’t a hill I’m willing to die on. He’s done some boneheaded things and still has a ways to go as a versatile receiver, but it’s not time to dump on him IMO.
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