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Nzoner's Game Room>***NON-POLITICAL COVID-19 Discussion Thread***
JakeF 10:28 PM 02-26-2020
A couple of reminders...

Originally Posted by Bwana:
Once again, don't come in this thread with some kind of political agenda, or you will be shown the door. If you want to go that route, there is a thread about this in DC.
Originally Posted by Dartgod:
People, there is a lot of good information in this thread, let's try to keep the petty bickering to a minimum.

We all have varying opinions about the impact of this, the numbers, etc. We will all never agree with each other. But we can all keep it civil.

Thanks!

Click here for the original OP:

Spoiler!

[Reply]
Skyy God 01:33 PM 09-01-2020
Originally Posted by kgrund:
Two major stories came out last two days the CDC 6% everybody is focusing on and the NYT article discussing the major flaws in the PCR testing. Is it just me that thinks the NYT article about the PCR testing is the far more news worthy of the two?
Really interesting article, thanks for the heads up.

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/08/29/h...s-testing.html
[Reply]
MahomesMagic 01:41 PM 09-01-2020
Originally Posted by Cave Johnson:
Really interesting article, thanks for the heads up.

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/08/29/h...s-testing.html
The PCR testing story was a bombshell. I knew months ago that this test wasn't measuring active infections of virus but when NY Times reported 37 to 40 cycles in the lab I was stunned.


I have a feeling that this is just the tip of the iceberg. This means that the media has been prattling on for months about "cases" without even knowing the basics of what a case was.

How many deaths "with Covid" disappear if we only count to 25, 30 cycles on the PCR test?
[Reply]
Donger 01:44 PM 09-01-2020
Originally Posted by MahomesMagic:
The PCR testing story was a bombshell. I knew months ago that this test wasn't measuring active infections of virus but when NY Times reported 37 to 40 cycles in the lab I was stunned.


I have a feeling that this is just the tip of the iceberg. This means that the media has been prattling on for months about "cases" without even knowing the basics of what a case was.

How many deaths "with Covid" disappear if we only count to 25, 30 cycles on the PCR test?
And how do you define a case?
[Reply]
O.city 02:02 PM 09-01-2020
If showing any sign of viral sequence at that high of a specificity is a case, there are a huge abundance of walking cases of various other virus's out there at this point.

We need to know who's infectious. You could lower the number in the PCR cycles and only throw a positive when there's a certain amount of virus.
[Reply]
suzzer99 02:02 PM 09-01-2020
Originally Posted by htismaqe:
The mandates they are requesting are already in place. If individual bars aren't following them, that's not necessarily something that I can personally quantify.
Indoor bars need to be closed in any place having issues. There is no way to mitigate covid spread in a bar.
[Reply]
suzzer99 02:04 PM 09-01-2020
Originally Posted by MahomesMagic:
The PCR testing story was a bombshell. I knew months ago that this test wasn't measuring active infections of virus but when NY Times reported 37 to 40 cycles in the lab I was stunned.


I have a feeling that this is just the tip of the iceberg. This means that the media has been prattling on for months about "cases" without even knowing the basics of what a case was.

How many deaths "with Covid" disappear if we only count to 25, 30 cycles on the PCR test?
Probably not that many. I know an ICU doc who says they pretty much know by now when it's covid and when it's not. There are tell-tale signs.
[Reply]
MahomesMagic 02:05 PM 09-01-2020
Originally Posted by Donger:
And how do you define a case?
Cases are defined however the state wants them to be. Right now that is any positive result from 37 to 40 cycles of the PCR test. This means that 40 to 90% of the "cases" reported in the media are not actively infectious.
[Reply]
htismaqe 02:06 PM 09-01-2020
Originally Posted by suzzer99:
Indoor bars need to be closed in any place having issues. There is no way to mitigate covid spread in a bar.
I don't disagree. All I was saying is that they've already ordered bars closed in the 6 counties that have large college populations. It's up to local authorities to make sure those mandates are being followed. I don't live in one of those areas so I can't say for sure the mandates are being obeyed.
[Reply]
Donger 02:06 PM 09-01-2020
Originally Posted by MahomesMagic:
Cases are defined however the state wants them to be. Right now that is any positive result from 37 to 40 cycles of the PCR test. This means that 40 to 90% of the "cases" reported in the media are not actively infectious.
Then the media has been accurate in their reporting of new cases.
[Reply]
O.city 02:18 PM 09-01-2020
We need to differentiate between infection and illness. You can have infection without illness, but not vice versa.

If you can't or aren't "infectious and spreading" when you have certain levels of infection and we have to be that specific with a test, we need to not worry about those people in terms of quarantine.
[Reply]
MahomesMagic 02:24 PM 09-01-2020
Originally Posted by Donger:
Then the media has been accurate in their reporting of new cases.
Sure..technically. They have also been incredibly misleading when they substitute cases and infections, which they do on TV and in writeups.

100 new cases at ____ school.

My first thought now is, "How many detected before 30 cycles?"


The idea that we should harm child education or our lives because people detected viral particles (maybe) needs to end now.


Saying the state defines cases reminds me of Divine Law Command Theory in college religion. God is Good..because he said so!
[Reply]
Donger 02:27 PM 09-01-2020
Originally Posted by MahomesMagic:
Sure..technically. They have also been incredibly misleading when they substitute cases and infections, which they do on TV and in writeups.

100 new cases at ____ school.

My first thought now is, "How many detected before 30 cycles?"


The idea that we should harm child education or our lives because people detected viral particles (maybe) needs to end now.
A case is an infection, as you just acknowledged. So there's nothing misleading about that either.
[Reply]
suzzer99 02:27 PM 09-01-2020
Originally Posted by htismaqe:
I don't disagree. All I was saying is that they've already ordered bars closed in the 6 counties that have large college populations. It's up to local authorities to make sure those mandates are being followed. I don't live in one of those areas so I can't say for sure the mandates are being obeyed.
Yeah.

In LA lots of gym owners are defying the order. I haven't seen any bars defying and staying open.
[Reply]
Donger 02:28 PM 09-01-2020
Originally Posted by O.city:
We need to differentiate between infection and illness. You can have infection without illness, but not vice versa.

If you can't or aren't "infectious and spreading" when you have certain levels of infection and we have to be that specific with a test, we need to not worry about those people in terms of quarantine.
I completely agree.
[Reply]
Discuss Thrower 02:34 PM 09-01-2020
Originally Posted by MahomesMagic:
The COVID Pandemic Could Lead to 75,000 Additional Deaths from Alcohol and Drug Misuse and Suicide

Alongside the thousands of deaths from COVID-19, the growing epidemic of “deaths of despair” is increasing due to the pandemic—as many as 75,000 more people will die from drug or alcohol misuse and suicide, according to new research released by Well Being Trust (WBT) and the Robert Graham Center for Policy Studies in Family Medicine and Primary Care.

The brief notes that if the country fails to invest in solutions that can help heal the nation’s isolation, pain, and suffering, the collective impact of COVID-19 will be even more devastating. Three factors, already at work, are exacerbating deaths of despair: unprecedented economic failure paired with massive unemployment, mandated social isolation for months

https://wellbeingtrust.org/areas-of-...ring-covid-19/
75,000 selfish people.
[Reply]
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