Because of all the interest in this thread, I've place all of the video content of Patrick Mahomes II's college career, and draft day goodness into a single post that can be found here. Enjoy! [Reply]
Originally Posted by staylor26:
It's the fucking Chargers.
Both of those WRs are hurt. His OL is hurt. His defense has multiple injuries. His HC is not an NFL HC.
Not to mention a Herbert himself has been playing hurt for the majority of the season.
You aren't giving the Ravens enough credit as a team and organization.
Also, regardless of the disappointment, the Chargers are still a "playoff contender". They're currently still a playoff team.
Were they hurt last year, too?
Didn't take you for a Herbert truther lol
LOL @ the idea of Herbert somehow leading the Lions to the playoffs when he can't even do it with twice the talent in LA.
Originally Posted by Detoxing:
Roster turnover would be part of the equation, whether you stated it or not.
The point of the Mahomes/Allen comparisons is that there really are a few QB's in the league that can do what you described. Lamar ain't one of them.
If you have to change the team and the scheme, then it really isn't "any" team, as in, the current state in which it's constructed.
Megatron laid it out well.
Without changing what the Lions do, can Lamar come in and lead a dynamic passing attack there? No. The answer is no. That specific Lions team, as it is presently constructed no.
Roster turnover wouldn't be necessary and I don't think Lamar would lead a dynamic passing attack anywhere, which is why he'd need a scheme change.
Again, I never stated or even implied that Jackson was on the same level, WHICH IS WHY I WAS SURE TO NOTE THAT HE'D REQUIRE A SCHEME CHANGE AND DID NOT DO THE SAME FOR MAHOMES OR ALLEN.
But you put him on a team, add some read-option here, RPO there, and Jackson would take any team to the playoffs with their current personnel and coaching staff. Not because he'd create some unstoppable air raid offense, but because he adds such a dynamic ground element that is difficult for most teams to defend. [Reply]
Herbert has finished 3rd in the AFCW both years. He has done nothing to prove he is anything more than a QB that looks good enough to keep from moving on from because next year it might just click and becomes a top flight QB.
His best chance is for something like what happened to Stafford. Get traded to a team with all the pieces except a just above average QB. [Reply]
Originally Posted by ThaVirus:
Were they hurt last year, too?
Didn't take you for a Herbert truther lol
LOL @ the idea of Herbert somehow leading the Lions to the playoffs when he can't even do it with twice the talent in LA.
Roster turnover wouldn't be necessary and I don't think Lamar would lead a dynamic passing attack anywhere, which is why he'd need a scheme change.
But you put him on a team, add some read-option here, RPO there, and Jackson would take any team to the playoffs with their current personnel and coaching staff. Not because he'd create some unstoppable air raid offense, but because he adds such a dynamic ground element that is difficult for most teams to defend.
Eh, I think you'd need to turn some of it over.
You'd need a top-tier TE for one thing. Most of their passing attack begins and ends with Mark Andrews. Lamar throws over the middle 80% of the time or more, so you wouldn't necessarily covet elite WRs, but you'd have to have at least one burner just to keep the defense honest. Plus at least one other TE, because Lamar needs another big target over the middle and that guy needs to run-block a ton.
And you'd have to have good RBs, because Lamar is a 30 att guy. much over 35 attempts, and his efficiency drops dramatically. Gotta have a consistent run game.
Which would mean a road-grading OL. A pass-centric OL is not going to cut it.
And Lamar needs to run it about 15 times a game. It's his legs that strike fear in defenses, not his arm or QB acumen. [Reply]
Originally Posted by ThaVirus:
Were they hurt last year, too?
Didn't take you for a Herbert truther lol
LOL @ the idea of Herbert somehow leading the Lions to the playoffs when he can't even do it with twice the talent in LA.
Roster turnover wouldn't be necessary and I don't think Lamar would lead a dynamic passing attack anywhere, which is why he'd need a scheme change.
Again, I never stated or even implied that Jackson was on the same level, WHICH IS WHY I WAS SURE TO NOTE THAT HE'D REQUIRE A SCHEME CHANGE AND DID NOT DO THE SAME FOR MAHOMES OR ALLEN.
But you put him on a team, add some read-option here, RPO there, and Jackson would take any team to the playoffs with their current personnel and coaching staff. Not because he'd create some unstoppable air raid offense, but because he adds such a dynamic ground element that is difficult for most teams to defend.
You said "playoff contender". If that's now changed to actually making the playoffs, then I completely reject your take that Lamar could take any team to the playoffs.
I'm not a "Herbert truther", but there's zero chance I'm taking Lamar over him. [Reply]
Originally Posted by penguinz:
Herbert has finished 3rd in the AFCW both years. He has done nothing to prove he is anything more than a QB that looks good enough to keep from moving on from because next year it might just click and becomes a top flight QB.
His best chance is for something like what happened to Stafford. Get traded to a team with all the pieces except a just above average QB.
And Lamar would fair any better on the Chargers having to deal with Andy/Pat? [Reply]
Originally Posted by Detoxing:
And an unimaginative play caller.
Yea, anybody that thinks that the transition with Lombardi at OC would go smoothly and be just like Greg Roman's offense hasn't been paying attention. [Reply]
Patrick Mahomes
Needs 4,500 passing yards and 35 touchdown passes to become the fourth quarterback ever with four career seasons of those totals, joining Tom Brady (five), Drew Brees (four) and Peyton Manning (four).
Needs 35 touchdown passes to become the fifth quarterback ever with four career seasons with at least 35 touchdown passes, joining Tom Brady (six), Aaron Rodgers (six), Drew Brees (four) and Peyton Manning (four).
Needs 2,264 passing yards in his first 12 starts to surpass Matthew Stafford (21,254) for the most passing yards ever by a player in his first 75 career starts. Mahomes has 18,991 passing yards in his career. Done
Needs 23 touchdown passes in his first 12 starts to surpass Dan Marino (173) for the most ever by a player in his first 75 career starts. Mahomes is at 151 career touchdown passes. DONE [Reply]
Originally Posted by penguinz:
Herbert has finished 3rd in the AFCW both years. He has done nothing to prove he is anything more than a QB that looks good enough to keep from moving on from because next year it might just click and becomes a top flight QB.
His best chance is for something like what happened to Stafford. Get traded to a team with all the pieces except a just above average QB.
Phillip Rivers 2.0 without the bitching... [Reply]
Originally Posted by Megatron96:
It's his legs that strike fear in defenses, not his arm or QB acumen.
I've never disagreed.
Originally Posted by staylor26:
You said "playoff contender". If that's now changed to actually making the playoffs, then I completely reject your take that Lamar could take any team to the playoffs.
I'm not a "Herbert truther", but there's zero chance I'm taking Lamar over him.
Yeah, I should never have said playoff contender. That would include scrub ass teams like the Raiders going 7-10 or 8-9. Any good QB should be able to make their team a .500 squad.
I would take Herbie over Lamar as well but only long term. If we're talking right here, right now, in this moment, who would change the fortunes of a team the most, I think Lamar would do so more than Herbie.
Which teams do you think Lamar would not be able to bring to the playoffs, assuming a slight shift in offensive scheme, of course? [Reply]
When this thread was bumped over the past few years, it was often times about some Jackson Mahomes shit. Anybody else notice the lack of that this year?