Cardinals beat the Nationals and Dodgers: "Big deal, it's just the Nationals and Dodgers"
Cubs beat the Reds and Mets: "Hey, the Reds are actually pretty good!"
I said if the Cardinals kept winning against the Dodgers and Rockies I would be impressed.
They are still overachieving, though. Unless you really want to believe Wong is a .900 OPS hitter and Tyler O'Neill is going to carry a 800+ OPS while striking out 40% of the time with what was a .450 BABIP.
About the only Cardinal I expect to continue hitting near where they have been on this streak is maybe Harrison Bader with a slight dip in his BABIP.
And I never said the Reds were good. I said they have a good offense, which they do, and the Cubs have been under performing all year with their starting pitchers and they shut down their offense for the entire series. Reading comprehension. [Reply]
I understand not picking up Murphy. I wasn't for it because of the possibility of messing up the mojo by adding an unfamiliar person into the locker room.
Its my understanding of the rules that we could have placed a claim on Murphy and blocked the Cubs from getting him but not be obligated to put him on your team, correct?
So....... has anyone heard from Mo on why he let Murphy go to the Cubs? [Reply]
Originally Posted by BigRedChief:
I understand not picking up Murphy. I wasn't for it because of getting our mojo messed up by adding an unfamiliar person into the locker room. Its my understanding of the rules that we could have placed a claim on Murphy and blocked the Cubs from getting him but not be obligated to put him on your team, correct?
So....... has anyone heard from Mo on why he let Murphy go to the Cubs?
He was on revocable trade waivers. The Nats theoretically could have just said 'okay, take him' and he'd have been a Cardinal had they put a claim in.
It happened to the Padres years ago with, I believe, Randy Jones. They were simply trying to put a block on, the team that had him said 'Okay, he's all yours' and the Padres got stuck with a guy they really didn't want at all.
But the idea that he'd have hurt the lockerroom is just stupid. The first time he went up there and worked a 9 pitch AB before doubling a run in, whatever 'unfamiliarity' they felt with a hard-working, long-time veteran and professional would have ceased.
It was laziness from Moe. And if it WAS concern over the lockerroom, that's just chickenshit and is somehow even worse. [Reply]
That waiver thing happened with Alex Rios too, the Blue Jays put him on waivers and the White Sox claimed him and the Jays reaction was "awesome take his 50 million dollar contract". [Reply]
Originally Posted by DJ's left nut:
He was on revocable trade waivers. The Nats theoretically could have just said 'okay, take him' and he'd have been a Cardinal had they put a claim in.
It happened to the Padres years ago with, I believe, Randy Jones. They were simply trying to put a block on, the team that had him said 'Okay, he's all yours' and the Padres got stuck with a guy they really didn't want at all.
But the idea that he'd have hurt the lockerroom is just stupid. The first time he went up there and worked a 9 pitch AB before doubling a run in, whatever 'unfamiliarity' they felt with a hard-working, long-time veteran and professional would have ceased.
It was laziness from Moe. And if it WAS concern over the lockerroom, that's just chickenshit and is somehow even worse.
okay, so I could see Mo being scared of getting stuck with Murphy. He is a risk adverse GM as I can remember. To the detriment of the team.
You dont know how the chemistry would have been affected. You "think" it would be "this" based on the evidence of past performance and personality. And I'd agree, seemed like a low % guy that would cause an issue in the locker room. However.............. ya never know.
We are winning not because of adding top shelf talent but team chemistry. Teams, especially baseball teams get on winning runs so many times because of team chemistry. 2011 we were flailing around and we got this infusion of bullpen guys that meshed with the current players and went on a run. Boston in 2004 etc. etc. [Reply]
Originally Posted by jd1020:
It was Nationals and Brewers.
I said if the Cardinals kept winning against the Dodgers and Rockies I would be impressed.
They are still overachieving, though. Unless you really want to believe Wong is a .900 OPS hitter and Tyler O'Neill is going to carry a 800+ OPS while striking out 40% of the time with what was a .450 BABIP.
About the only Cardinal I expect to continue hitting near where they have been on this streak is maybe Harrison Bader with a slight dip in his BABIP.
And I never said the Reds were good. I said they have a good offense, which they do, and the Cubs have been under performing all year with their starting pitchers and they shut down their offense for the entire series. Reading comprehension.
If you look at their underlying numbers, their record over the course of the season is almost exactly what it's supposed to be. It's not just Pythagorean, but weighted runs against, etc...
Pretty much every model that looks at how they've performed statistically over the course of the season says that the Cardinals should be roughly 14-16 games over .500 right now. And yes, that includes recent hot stretches from guys like Wong, but it also includes his cold streaks.
It includes an .800 OPS from O'Neill, but it also includes 4 months of complete ass from Fowler. And while O'Neill may not be this good going forward (assuming that a 23 yr old kid with serious prospect pedigree has no room for growth is a fools errand, but I digress), he doesn't have to be. He simply has to be as good as the combination of what we've gotten from him and Fowler over the first 130 games or so.
Matt Carpenter will not stay that hot, but of late Gyorko has found his groove after a cold first 3 months to supplement him. Jose Martinez has found OF more to his liking defensively so we can keep his bat in there now as well.
You're putting forth a series of stipulations that would make the Cardinals a 105 win team. That's how they've played for the month in question but that's not the mark they need now; they've done that to get themselves back to level ground. Now they can simply play to their regular talent level which the whole season, inclusive of fits and starts, says is roughly a 90 win team.
That'll play. And if you get to October with that and a hot rotation, things can get interesting in a hurry. [Reply]
Bob Nightengale is a stupid asshole who never gets a thing right but just makes shit up as he goes.
However, the Cardinals announced a 4p presser and Nightengale 'confirms' its to remove Shildt's interim tag and announce an extension.
He's probably right by default because that's the only sensible reason to announce a presser on August 28 and what the hell else could Shildt do to get the tag removed? But I refuse to give him any credit for it.
Originally Posted by BigRedChief:
okay, so I could see Mo being scared of getting stuck with Murphy. He is a risk adverse GM as I can remember. To the detriment of the team.
You dont know how the chemistry would have been affected. You "think" it would be "this" based on the evidence of past performance and personality. And I'd agree, seemed like a low % guy that would cause an issue in the locker room. However.............. ya never know.
We are winning not because of adding top shelf talent but team chemistry. Teams, especially baseball teams get on winning runs so many times because of team chemistry. 2011 we were flailing around and we got this infusion of bullpen guys that meshed with the current players and went on a run. Boston in 2004 etc. etc.
Boston in 2004 had Manny, Ortiz, Schilling and Pedro. Varitek put up an .870 OPS and Damon had arguably the best year of a near HoF career.
Let's pump the brakes on the "Boston was a plucky underdog that won with chemistry' conversation. Boston was incredibly talented and won because Julian Taverez piped a cockshot to Mark Bellhorn.
The 2011 squad had Pujols, Berkman, Holliday and Molina along with Chris Carpenter knowing it was his last ride and laying it all on the line. There was a ton of talent on that squad as well.
Adding more talent is only a mistake if the talent in question is Jonathan Papelbon or some other miscreant with a history of being a shitheel. Daniel Murphy is not that shitheel. He's a hardnosed ballplayer who's won in October and who's demonstrated a wealth of skills offensively that would've helped this team.
If Mozeliak didn't put a claim in due to concern over the clubhouse, then he'd better by God be right. Because if the extent of his backbone was firing a clearly inept field manager, then JD will be right and the Cardinals are poised to be an pretty decent also-ran for the next 1/2 decade or more. [Reply]
Originally Posted by DJ's left nut:
Bob Nightengale is a stupid asshole who never gets a thing right but just makes shit up as he goes.
However, the Cardinals announced a 4p presser and Nightengale 'confirms' its to remove Shildt's interim tag and announce an extension.
He's probably right by default because that's the only sensible reason to announce a presser on August 28 and what the hell else could Shildt do to get the tag removed? But I refuse to give him any credit for it.
Originally Posted by DJ's left nut:
Bob Nightengale is a stupid asshole who never gets a thing right but just makes shit up as he goes.
However, the Cardinals announced a 4p presser and Nightengale 'confirms' its to remove Shildt's interim tag and announce an extension.
He's probably right by default because that's the only sensible reason to announce a presser on August 28 and what the hell else could Shildt do to get the tag removed? But I refuse to give him any credit for it.
Yeah putting aside the trashing of Nightengale(which is fully approved by me), I like and expected this move. It's Mo who found the guy, gave him a shot, promoted and groomed Schildt. With this start and the players going to him and Dewitt telling them to remove the intermin tag made this inevitable.
Manager money ain't shit anymore. His daily meetings and schtick gets old, they can move on without now paying two managers to not manage while paying a 3rd manager.
