Originally Posted by Bwana:
Once again, don't come in this thread with some kind of political agenda, or you will be shown the door. If you want to go that route, there is a thread about this in DC.
Originally Posted by Dartgod:
People, there is a lot of good information in this thread, let's try to keep the petty bickering to a minimum.
We all have varying opinions about the impact of this, the numbers, etc. We will all never agree with each other. But we can all keep it civil.
Thanks!
Click here for the original OP:
Spoiler!
Apparently the CoronaVirus can survive on a inanimate objects, such as door knobs, for 9 days.
California coronavirus case could be first spread within U.S. community, CDC says
By SOUMYA KARLAMANGLA, JACLYN COSGROVE
FEB. 26, 2020 8:04 PM
The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention is investigating what could be the first case of novel coronavirus in the United States involving a patient in California who neither recently traveled out of the country nor was in contact with someone who did.
“At this time, the patient’s exposure is unknown. It’s possible this could be an instance of community spread of COVID-19, which would be the first time this has happened in the United States,” the CDC said in a statement. “Community spread means spread of an illness for which the source of infection is unknown. It’s also possible, however, that the patient may have been exposed to a returned traveler who was infected.”
The individual is a resident of Solano County and is receiving medical care in Sacramento County, according to the state Department of Public Health.
The CDC said the “case was detected through the U.S. public health system — picked up by astute clinicians.”
Officials at UC Davis Medical Center expanded on what the federal agency might have meant by that in an email sent Wednesday, as reported by the Davis Enterprise newspaper.
The patient arrived at UC Davis Medical Center from another hospital Feb. 19 and “had already been intubated, was on a ventilator, and given droplet protection orders because of an undiagnosed and suspected viral condition,” according to an email sent by UC Davis officials that was obtained by the Davis Enterprise.
The staff at UC Davis requested COVID-19 testing by the CDC, but because the patient didn’t fit the CDC’s existing criteria for the virus, a test wasn’t immediately administered, according to the email. The CDC then ordered the test Sunday, and results were announced Wednesday. Hospital administrators reportedly said in the email that despite these issues, there has been minimal exposure at the hospital because of safety protocols they have in place.
A UC Davis Health spokesperson declined Wednesday evening to share the email with The Times.
Since Feb. 2, more than 8,400 returning travelers from China have entered California, according to the state health department. They have been advised to self-quarantine for 14 days and limit interactions with others as much as possible, officials said.
“This is a new virus, and while we are still learning about it, there is a lot we already know,” Dr. Sonia Angell, director of the California Department of Public Health, said in a statement. “We have been anticipating the potential for such a case in the U.S., and given our close familial, social and business relationships with China, it is not unexpected that the first case in the U.S. would be in California.”
It is not clear how the person became infected, but public health workers could not identify any contacts with people who had traveled to China or other areas where the virus is widespread. That raises concern that the virus is spreading in the United States, creating a challenge for public health officials, experts say.
“It’s the first signal that we could be having silent transmission in the community,” said Lawrence Gostin, director of the World Health Organization Collaborating Center on National and Global Health Law. “It probably means there are many more cases out there, and it probably means this individual has infected others, and now it’s a race to try to find out who that person has infected.”
On Tuesday, the CDC offered its most serious warning to date that the United States should expect and prepare for the coronavirus to become a more widespread health issue.
“Ultimately, we expect we will see coronavirus spread in this country,” said Nancy Messonnier, director of the CDC’s National Center for Immunization and Respiratory Diseases. “It’s not so much a question of if, but a question of when.”
According to the CDC’s latest count Wednesday morning, 59 U.S. residents have tested positive for the new strain of coronavirus — 42 of whom are repatriated citizens from a Diamond Princess cruise. That number has grown by two since Messonnier’s last count Tuesday, although the CDC was not immediately available to offer details on the additional cases.
More than 82,000 cases of coronavirus have been reported globally, and more than 2,700 people have died, with the majority in mainland China, the epicenter of the outbreak.
But public health leaders have repeatedly reminded residents that the health risk from the novel coronavirus to the general public remains low.
“While COVID-19 has a high transmission rate, it has a low mortality rate,” the state Department of Public Health said in a statement Wednesday. “From the international data we have, of those who have tested positive for COVID-19, approximately 80% do not exhibit symptoms that would require hospitalization. There have been no confirmed deaths related to COVID-19 in the United States to date.”
CDC officials have also warned that although the virus is likely to spread in U.S. communities, the flu still poses a greater risk.
Gostin said the news of potential silent transmission does not eliminate the possibility of containing the virus in the U.S. and preventing an outbreak.
“There are few enough cases that we should at least try,” he said. “Most of us are not optimistic that that will be successful, but we’re still in the position to try.”
Originally Posted by Monticore:
If you reopen, restock, rehire, then relapse it could be worse. I think it should be baby steps .
That is essentially my concern if we end up back at square once by jumping so fast so quick it will be far worse, if you tell people we're going back to lockdown the reaction will be far worse. [Reply]
Originally Posted by kgrund:
No question that their could be exceptions. However, it is the overwhelming majority. I have been auditing financial institutions for almost 30 years. I have a pretty good handle on what I am talking about.
Oh, come on, man! There's no way that you know more about financial institutions than pete!
Originally Posted by DaFace:
What's your feel on where the "acceptable level" of deaths is for this situation?
I think you let the citizens decide. Open up schools again, let all businesses open, let weddings commence and funerals and church services. Our civic leaders can suggest safe practices and social distancing and of course if folks feel uncomfortable that is their prerogative and they can do what they are comfortable doing or not doing. The reason for flattening the curve was to slow the rate of spread as to not overwhelm facilities.....OK, we did it. Now 2 weeks has turned into 8 weeks or longer and economically we are dangerously close to irreparable harm... [Reply]
Originally Posted by Detoxing:
Fuck everyone but me sounds harsh. That's fine. Sometimes reality is harsh.
But when one makes arguments in favor of continuing a lockdown because they're worried they or their family may get sick, well that's a "fuck everyone but me" argument as well.
well it's probably people worrying about everyone getting sick, just speaking from my POV.
so it's actually "fuck the people who dont care about others dying from a virus" i guess [Reply]
Originally Posted by Mecca:
What about when about 70% of the country favors staying in lockdown?
My first inclination is to seriously doubt those numbers because damn near nothing in this country is that one sided. I'd have to ask you to show your work/sources before even considering it to argue against.
Secondly, every decision we make is a selfish decision. Whether its to stay on lockdown to protect the elderly in your family because you're afforded the luxury of that being your primary concern, or wanting to open up because figuring out how to feed your family to the point of relying on Food banks and churches (essentially, allowing your fear to force a family into poverty and homelessness btw) to eat is too stressful and uncertain.
You have your reasons. That guy has his reasons. Your reasons aren't more concerning to him than his own and vice versa.
Blah sorry. The "well i need to protect my elderly" arguments drive me nuts.
EVERYONE has something/someone they are looking to protect. [Reply]
Originally Posted by Mecca:
That is essentially my concern if we end up back at square once by jumping so fast so quick it will be far worse, if you tell people we're going back to lockdown the reaction will be far worse.
the people ignoring the shut downs fuck everyone else over. the people who did it right are screwed. the other assholes just kept spreading it and it's still going strong because they didnt shelter in place.
those are the "fuck everyone else but me" crowd [Reply]
Originally Posted by Mecca:
What about when about 70% of the country favors staying in lockdown?
That will change quickly when the unemployment number climbs to the predicted 30% and government money runs out...
Shit, in many cases people are making twice what they made working while on unemployment... That doesn't last forever and jobs won't come back if this goes on much longer. [Reply]
Originally Posted by SAUTO:
well it's probably people worrying about everyone getting sick, just speaking from my POV.
See, that's a concern that you are afforded. I believe that if that's your primary concern then you should consider yourself lucky.
Because people who are actually suffering and struggling through this are worried about their immediate needs, not hoping for the lives of strangers they don't know. [Reply]
Originally Posted by Detoxing:
See, that's a concern that you are afforded. I believe that if that's your primary concern then you should consider yourself lucky.
Because people who are actually suffering and struggling through this are worried about their immediate needs, not hoping for the lives of strangers they don't know.
Originally Posted by SAUTO:
the people ignoring the shut downs **** everyone else over. the people who did it right are screwed. the other assholes just kept spreading it and it's still going strong because they didnt shelter in place.
those are the "**** everyone else but me" crowd
Oh so man the border with mines/turrets/military? What are you guys not understanding about the word pandemic?
The Shelter in place was to keep hospitals from getting overwhelmed.. Now you think that is a viable strategy to fight the virus (It's not, Science says as much) [Reply]
Originally Posted by SAUTO:
the people ignoring the shut downs **** everyone else over. the people who did it right are screwed. the other assholes just kept spreading it and it's still going strong because they didnt shelter in place.
those are the "**** everyone else but me" crowd
Seriously, the virus isn't going anywhere and a vaccine is probably 50/50 at best. We flattened the curve as we were told, the balancing point is here... It's not black and white, it's very gray... If you can't see the toll a Depression would have on the US, let along the World, then there is no convincing you as you believe Covid-19 deaths are worth saving more than economic induced deaths around the World, most likely in numbers that Dwarf this virus. [Reply]
Originally Posted by Monticore:
Do you think clutching to a piece of paper written in the 1700s is a great way to run a country today?
More than ever before. It was written by those who understood tyranny probably better than most today. It`s the near perfect owners manual for running any country. Granted, much of it isnt followed closely any longer [Reply]